Bmac

NHL 2017-18

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Morgo's a Canucks fan again?

 

And no. Losing the Vancouver script would improve those jerseys 46%. Near perfect.

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On 1/21/2018 at 4:33 PM, Chromatic said:

Yes the script has tenuous historical precedence, but that doesn’t make it a good look in its current incarnation.


I realize I'm in the minority but I think it looks great.  The arc fits well with the curved nature of the Orca and the one-layer treatment matches the number and name treatment.  I don't get a "copy-paste" vibe at all.
 

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Yes other teams have mismatched colours but that doesn’t mean the Canucks copypasted orca looks good on their uniforms.

 

I would hardly call the colours mismatched. Their main colour is Royal Blue and it's featured prominently on the Orca.  The silver is used on all their logos and the Navy is just a darker blue that doesn't look wildly out of place.

 

And for those decrying the lack of green on the Orca you should note that the universally acclaimed Golden Knights uniforms do the exact same thing with red.  The colour is featured on the striping, socks and shoulder patches but nowhere on their main logo.
 

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I don’t like this idea that fans should be content with an identity just because they’ d changed enough times the fans have Stockholm syndrome.

 

If the uniforms were awful that obviously wouldn't mean a thing but for the reasons I stated above I don't think that's the case.

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46 minutes ago, Morgo said:


I realize I'm in the minority but I think it looks great.  The arc fits well with the curved nature of the Orca and the one-layer treatment matches the number and name treatment.  I don't get a "copy-paste" vibe at all.
 

 

I would hardly call the colours mismatched. Their main colour is Royal Blue and it's featured prominently on the Orca.  The silver is used on all their logos and the Navy is just a darker blue that doesn't look wildly out of place.

 

And for those decrying the lack of green on the Orca you should note that the universally acclaimed Golden Knights uniforms do the exact same thing with red.  The colour is featured on the striping, socks and shoulder patches but nowhere on their main logo.
 

 

If the uniforms were awful that obviously wouldn't mean a thing but for the reasons I stated above I don't think that's the case.

 

I don’t mind the lettering at all, but what they do with dark blue and silver could easily be achieved with royal blue and white. It’s just not necessary.

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I think the Canucks should just go with the 1970 throwbacks they wore seven years ago.

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4 hours ago, Morgo said:


I realize I'm in the minority but I think it looks great.  The arc fits well with the curved nature of the Orca and the one-layer treatment matches the number and name treatment.  I don't get a "copy-paste" vibe at all.

 

I definitely get the copy paste vibe. The script seems like a completely tangential and slapped on part of the logo. It doesn't 'connect' with the Orca. And I don't mean that in a literal sense of course. I mean there is already so much going on with the orca logo, having 'VANCOUVER' floating above it just makes it feel more disjointed, evidenced by the fact that people on here didn't even know it was part of the logo and thought it was just a uniform feature.

 

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I would hardly call the colours mismatched. Their main colour is Royal Blue and it's featured prominently on the Orca.  The silver is used on all their logos and the Navy is just a darker blue that doesn't look wildly out of place.

It really does feel mismatched though. As someone pointed out it looks like a beer league jersey that was hastilyscreen printed on. I don't think the colours on logos need to match identically with the uniforms, but if we look at the home jersey, it really doesn't look like it belongs. The blue is so dark it might as well be black, coupled with silver and white. Thats in conjunction with a uniform that uses bright shades of blue and green. The away is a little better because its balanced a little more with the royal blue "ice", but the home is almost a complete mismatch.And its not just the colours either. Its weird seeing such a dynamic, stylized, detailed logo on a uniform with such traditional striping. You can really see this if you look at the uniforms the Orca debuted with because it was designed for them and matches the uniform.

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When people say the Orca looks 'copypasted' they're not just slagging on it because the colours don't match. It really was copypasted. They lifted it from this jersey and stuck it on the jersey of another era with slightly tweaked colours. And it shows.

 

 

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and for those decrying the lack of green on the Orca you should note that the universally acclaimed Golden Knights uniforms do the exact same thing with red.  The colour is featured on the striping, socks and shoulder patches but nowhere on their main logo.

 You bring up features of other uniforms and people liking it as an argument for why another team doing something similar looks good, but its not related in anyway. People liking the tiny amount of red trim on the Golden Knights uniform that isn't in their logo has absolutely nothing to do with whether a feature of the Canucks uniform looks good. Watch what I can do here.

 

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Look, this universally despised Islanders uniform has an arched wordmark on the crest! Therefore the Canucks wordmark looks bad too, thats the reasoning why.

 

But in actuality we both know these two features exist in entirely separate identities and can't seriously be compared.

 

 

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If the uniforms were awful that obviously wouldn't mean a thing but for the reasons I stated above I don't think that's the case.

I don't think the uniforms are awful. I think the uniforms are amazing. I just hate that the Orca is on the front of them, because I think its an awful, awful logo, and it drags down what is an otherwise stellar identity. If we're looking at it from a pure design perspective, I'd say the only teams with worse logos are the Oilers and Islanders, however they have decades of success and history behind them so it would be sacrilege to change.

 

The only defenses I've heard about the Orca are from people who grew up with it (and I did too) or people who are sick of the Canucks changing and just want them to stick to a look. FWIW I think the Canucks identity crisis issues are overblown. But I don't think you should stick to a subpar look just because you don't want to change again. If the Sabres had kept the Buffaslug I don't think fans should be content with keeping it just for the sake of brand building/continuity.

 

I get it if you like the Orca, its all subjective anyway. Everyone gets an opinion. But thats why the Canucks identity is such an issue. Everybody has their perfect look for the team in their mind but they rarely, rarely line up. I'm fine with them keeping the uniforms as they are just so the striping and colours don't change, but I still don't like the crest.

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5 hours ago, Morgo said:

And for those decrying the lack of green on the Orca you should note that the universally acclaimed Golden Knights uniforms do the exact same thing with red.  The colour is featured on the striping, socks and shoulder patches but nowhere on their main logo.

The difference IMO is that the Knights are black/gray/gold/red; red is the tertiary or quaternary color. A black and gold logo still looks like them. Knocking the orca down from blue/green to just blue is a bigger change. I have the same issue with the Sabres’ new Winter Classic jersey. The Sabres are a blue and yellow team, but the jersey has big chunks where it’s just blue/white, like a Leafs jersey was copy-pasted in a mock-up. If you look at the back, with the yoke, the name, and numbers, it feels like there’s some missing yellow. That’s the same way I feel about the blue orca.

 

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I once read that they put the Vancouver script above the Orca due to them hosting the Olympics. Apparently they thought tourists would eat them up when looking for merchandise. No clue if true or not 

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2 hours ago, bowld said:

I once read that they put the Vancouver script above the Orca due to them hosting the Olympics. Apparently they thought tourists would eat them up when looking for merchandise. No clue if true or not 

 

I heard a similar rumor...and the timing of the change seems to give it some credence. However, if that was the case, why have they continued to use the logo so many years after? Unless the organization feels like there's too much equity in the logo (especially after their 2011 cup run) to give it up. Although I'm skeptical of that explanation too. 

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10 minutes ago, Thaumatrope said:

 

I heard a similar rumor...and the timing of the change seems to give it some credence. However, if that was the case, why have they continued to use the logo so many years after? Unless the organization feels like there's too much equity in the logo (especially after their 2011 cup run) to give it up. Although I'm skeptical of that explanation too. 

 

They're trying to create more "historical precedent." The longer the script continues, the easier it is for some poor, misguided soul to come along 30 years in the future and justifiably say, "Vancouver having a copy/paste wordmark above their jersey crest is based on historical precedent."

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10 hours ago, Chromatic said:

 

I definitely get the copy paste vibe. The script seems like a completely tangential and slapped on part of the logo. It doesn't 'connect' with the Orca. And I don't mean that in a literal sense of course. I mean there is already so much going on with the orca logo, having 'VANCOUVER' floating above it just makes it feel more disjointed, evidenced by the fact that people on here didn't even know it was part of the logo and thought it was just a uniform feature.


Slapped on?  The curve of the script aligns perfectly with the curve of the logo and the Orca really isn't that complicated of a logo.  There's a stylized whale, the breaking ice and the 'C' itself.  Having versions with and without the script is probably the reason for the confusion. 
 

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It really does feel mismatched though. As someone pointed out it looks like a beer league jersey that was hastilyscreen printed on. I don't think the colours on logos need to match identically with the uniforms, but if we look at the home jersey, it really doesn't look like it belongs. The blue is so dark it might as well be black, coupled with silver and white. Thats in conjunction with a uniform that uses bright shades of blue and green. The away is a little better because its balanced a little more with the royal blue "ice", but the home is almost a complete mismatch.And its not just the colours either. Its weird seeing such a dynamic, stylized, detailed logo on a uniform with such traditional striping. You can really see this if you look at the uniforms the Orca debuted with because it was designed for them and matches the uniform.


I'm not seeing mismatched uniform when I look at this. nor have I ever seen black when looking at the Orca.  You claim the road jersey better balanced because the Ice is royal blue when all they did on the home was switch it out for white to match the script colour.  Not only does this connect the script to the Orca but it also makes the logo contrast better on the uniform.  The script, numbers and captain patches are all white so it makes sense that the Orca would be primarily white as well.

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You bring up features of other uniforms and people liking it as an argument for why another team doing something similar looks good, but its not related in anyway. People liking the tiny amount of red trim on the Golden Knights uniform that isn't in their logo has absolutely nothing to do with whether a feature of the Canucks uniform looks good. Watch what I can do here.


I brought it up to illustrate that the striping and logo colours don't have to match to create a cohesive look.  If they did the Blackhawks would have incorporated tan, yellow, orange and green into their stripes.
 

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I don't think the uniforms are awful. I think the uniforms are amazing. I just hate that the Orca is on the front of them, because I think its an awful, awful logo, and it drags down what is an otherwise stellar identity. If we're looking at it from a pure design perspective, I'd say the only teams with worse logos are the Oilers and Islanders, however they have decades of success and history behind them so it would be sacrilege to change.

 

I think there are plenty of teams with worse logos.  The Panthers, Kings and Capitals spring immediately to mind.

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, bowld said:

I once read that they put the Vancouver script above the Orca due to them hosting the Olympics. Apparently they thought tourists would eat them up when looking for merchandise. No clue if true or not 

 

Yep.  Remembering one of the local broadcasters said that on air.  At this point, unless the entire logo is changed, I doubt they will ever get rid of the script.  I know Tampa did eventually, but that was only on the road jersey in the first place and it was for a shorter time.

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12 hours ago, Chromatic said:

I definitely get the copy paste vibe.

Agreed. For me it’s the fact that the “VANCOUVER” text and logo just don’t mesh aesthetically. The logo, though recoloured, is still a product of the late 90s. A detailed, aggressive animal logo. 

 

The text, meanwhile, is very simple. More in line with current minimalistic trends. It doesn’t look like it was designed to go with the logo because it wasn’t. 

 

The result is that the front of the Canucks’ sweater looks like what it is. Pieces of two disparate identities rammed together. 

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1 hour ago, Ice_Cap said:

The logo, though recoloured, is still a product of the late 90s. A detailed, aggressive animal logo.


Honestly, every time there's a logo you don't like you play the "overly detailed, aggressive, 90's" card and it's getting beyond tiresome.  The logo isn't even that detailed or aggressive.  If the whale looks angry it's a reflection of the Haida-Art style not on a desire to jump on some "late 90's Xtreme" bandwagon. 

 

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For me it’s the fact that the “VANCOUVER” text and logo just don’t mesh aesthetically

 

I don't agree but this is a fair criticism.  Just curious though, what do you think the Canucks should do to make their identity perfect?

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38 minutes ago, Morgo said:

Honestly, every time there's a logo you don't like you play the "overly detailed, aggressive, 90's" card and it's getting beyond tiresome. 

I wasn't even talking to you and you decide to get personal with it. More proof from our earlier discussion that you need to do something about that hair trigger. Not every person with a conflicting opinion is out to personally get you. Nor are they required to keep quiet to avoid upsetting your sensibilities.

 

To the point? I didn't even say that the Canucks' logo was bad. I was merely explaining how it didn't fit with the "VANCOUVER" text it's been paired with. Yet you leapt immediately to the "WHAT? ICE_CAP HATES ANOTHER 90S LOGO? TO THE INTERNET BOX!"

 

40 minutes ago, Morgo said:

  The logo isn't even that detailed or aggressive.  If the whale looks angry it's a reflection of the Haida-Art style

I'll just point you to the Seattle Seahawks' original logo vs current logo. That style doesn't have be as agressive as the Canucks' logo makes it out to be.

 

41 minutes ago, Morgo said:

Just curious though, what do you think the Canucks should do to make their identity perfect?

I mean there are a few ways. The first option would be to keep the orca but drop the VANCOUVER text. The second option would be to keep the VANCOUVER text but redesign the orca/C, keeping the same spirit but simplifying it a bit to better match the flat style the text uses. The third option would be to drop both the orca and text entirely and just run with the V/Johnny mashup as the primary.

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4 hours ago, Ice_Cap said:

I wasn't even talking to you and you decide to get personal with it. More proof from our earlier discussion that you need to do something about that hair trigger. Not every person with a conflicting opinion is out to personally get you. Nor are they required to keep quiet to avoid upsetting your sensibilities.


I hardly think saying the logo doesn't belong in the same category of detailed, aggressive, 90's logos constitutes as a personal attack.  But I guess it came off that way so I will apologize for that.

 

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I'll just point you to the Seattle Seahawks' original logo vs current logo. That style doesn't have be as agressive as the Canucks' logo makes it out to be.


This is interesting because if the Canucks could improve the Orca as much the Seahawks improved their logo in 2002, I'd definitely be on board.
 

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I mean there are a few ways. The first option would be to keep the orca but drop the VANCOUVER text. The second option would be to keep the VANCOUVER text but redesign the orca/C, keeping the same spirit but simplifying it a bit to better match the flat style the text uses. The third option would be to drop both the orca and text entirely and just run with the V/Johnny mashup as the primary.

 

Replacing the Orca/Script with the V/Johnny Canuck logo and leaving everything else untouched is one of the few proposed changes I could live with.  You wouldn't lose the great aspects of the current look and It would solve the colour inconsistency of the logo. 

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Besides Ottawa wearing their outdoor jersey for multiple games this season, will there be any other teams that will be wearing their outdoor jerseys more than once this season?

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5 hours ago, Ice_Cap said:

I mean there are a few ways. The first option would be to keep the orca but drop the VANCOUVER text. The second option would be to keep the VANCOUVER text but redesign the orca/C, keeping the same spirit but simplifying it a bit to better match the flat style the text uses. The third option would be to drop both the orca and text entirely and just run with the V/Johnny mashup as the primary.

 

I only see one option.

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5 hours ago, Morgo said:

I don't agree but this is a fair criticism.  Just curious though, what do you think the Canucks should do to make their identity perfect?

Perfect?  I don't know about that.  But I would like to see the wordmark removed.  It really does seem out of place


The other thing I'd like to see is better integration of green.  Green is on the sleeve/hem stripes but then is totally missing front and center.  Finding a way to have some green trim on the logo and green outlines on the numbers would go a long way.

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2 hours ago, OnWis97 said:

Perfect?  I don't know about that.  But I would like to see the wordmark removed.  It really does seem out of place


The other thing I'd like to see is better integration of green.  Green is on the sleeve/hem stripes but then is totally missing front and center.  Finding a way to have some green trim on the logo and green outlines on the numbers would go a long way.

 

Do you feel the Blackhawks need to incorporate all the colours in their logo into their jersey colours? Or the Senators? They have essentially the same issue, colours in one part of the uniform that don't appear elsewhere. 

 

I have never seen a concept for Green on the orca logo that didn't look awful. Generally, it makes it look like it has algae growing on it, which is usually a bad sign for aquatic creatures I think. 

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8 hours ago, Morgo said:

Honestly, every time there's a logo you don't like you play the "overly detailed, aggressive, 90's" card and it's getting beyond tiresome.

 

I really don’t see how this could be construed as anything other than a personal attack.

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