2008 MLB Season

[Shumway]

Hey, the Angels actually beat the Raymonds tonight. That's one win for the whole season at the Juicebox for the Halos. Granted, Figgins was out at third, but I'll take a win, especially if it means ending a 3-game skid and another K-Rod save. That's 47, for those counting.

[infrared41]

Hey, the Angels actually beat the Raymonds tonight. That's one win for the whole season at the Juicebox for the Halos. Granted, Figgins was out at third, but I'll take a win, especially if it means ending a 3-game skid and another K-Rod save. That's 47, for those counting.

He was out at first on that infield single too but that play didn't figure in the outcome.

[See Red]

And Curty, wouldn't giving the Cy Young to K-Rod be the same as essentially giving it to a Starter just based on Wins?

If K-Rod gets the all-time saves record (which he's currently on pace to do), he would have to be my pick. I mean if Cliff Lee set the all-time wins record, he would probably pick up every single first-place vote. The saves record should matter for something.

But he shouldn't be rewarded for getting more opportunities. Rivera and Papelbon have much better ERAs -- a full run better, in fact. I feel like looking into the sabermetrics but I'm sure they'd support my case.

Joe Nathan and Jokim Soria are just as deserving as Rivera and Papelbon, but you won't hear their names get mentioned in Cy Young voting either.

K-Rod's ERA of 2.81 isn't bad at all, and if he can the saves record, it will carry some weight -- especially if Cliff Lee comes back down to earth in September.

I'm not trying to say Papelbon or Rivera are should win the Cy Young. I don't mean to come off like that, as a Red Sox fan, those are the two names that immediately come to mind as having been better than K-Rod. 2.81 isn't bad at all, but it doesn't really compare to a 1.80 or a 1.60, which is approximately where Papelbon and Rivera are respectively. And having just looked into FIP's, which are a better judge than ERA, it more than supports my case. Papelbon's around a 1.90, Rivera just over 2.00, and K-Rod is at a 3.40, which suggests he's been lucky to even be at that 2.81 ERA.

So then why don't we just award the AL Cy Young to the pitcher with the best FIP? -- Which, oh by the way, isn't even an actual MLB stat.

I'm sure there are many pitchers who have better averages than Francisco Rodriguez. But like it or not, he will get more Cy Young votes than Papelbon and Rivera combined based on his pursuit of the all-time saves record.

It's not, but it's a sabermetric stat. You want official stats? Look at WHIP... Look at ERA. A one run difference in ERA is a pretty big difference, but you want to hand him the Cy Young because, what, his team wins more close games? Because, what, he gets more opportunities to do something he has absolutely no control over? There is absolutely no difference between using saves and wins to determine the Cy Young winner. None.

You can say what you want about FIP but find me a better stat to determine how well somebody has pitched. Over an extended period of time, ERA's tend to trend towards FIP.

Again, I'm not saying either of the two guys I named deserve to be considered for the Cy Young... I'm saying both have pitched better than K-Rod this year.

[tp49]

And Curty, wouldn't giving the Cy Young to K-Rod be the same as essentially giving it to a Starter just based on Wins?

If K-Rod gets the all-time saves record (which he's currently on pace to do), he would have to be my pick. I mean if Cliff Lee set the all-time wins record, he would probably pick up every single first-place vote. The saves record should matter for something.

But he shouldn't be rewarded for getting more opportunities. Rivera and Papelbon have much better ERAs -- a full run better, in fact. I feel like looking into the sabermetrics but I'm sure they'd support my case.

Joe Nathan and Jokim Soria are just as deserving as Rivera and Papelbon, but you won't hear their names get mentioned in Cy Young voting either.

K-Rod's ERA of 2.81 isn't bad at all, and if he can the saves record, it will carry some weight -- especially if Cliff Lee comes back down to earth in September.

I'm not trying to say Papelbon or Rivera are should win the Cy Young. I don't mean to come off like that, as a Red Sox fan, those are the two names that immediately come to mind as having been better than K-Rod. 2.81 isn't bad at all, but it doesn't really compare to a 1.80 or a 1.60, which is approximately where Papelbon and Rivera are respectively. And having just looked into FIP's, which are a better judge than ERA, it more than supports my case. Papelbon's around a 1.90, Rivera just over 2.00, and K-Rod is at a 3.40, which suggests he's been lucky to even be at that 2.81 ERA.

So then why don't we just award the AL Cy Young to the pitcher with the best FIP? -- Which, oh by the way, isn't even an actual MLB stat.

I'm sure there are many pitchers who have better averages than Francisco Rodriguez. But like it or not, he will get more Cy Young votes than Papelbon and Rivera combined based on his pursuit of the all-time saves record.

It's not, but it's a sabermetric stat. You want official stats? Look at WHIP... Look at ERA. A one run difference in ERA is a pretty big difference, but you want to hand him the Cy Young because, what, his team wins more close games? Because, what, he gets more opportunities to do something he has absolutely no control over? There is absolutely no difference between using saves and wins to determine the Cy Young winner. None.

You can say what you want about FIP but find me a better stat to determine how well somebody has pitched. Over an extended period of time, ERA's tend to trend towards FIP.

Again, I'm not saying either of the two guys I named deserve to be considered for the Cy Young... I'm saying both have pitched better than K-Rod this year.

Also, with all this discussion of how K-Rod should win the Cy Young if he gets the saves record let's not forget that when Bobby Thigpen got the single season saves record back in 1990 he finished 4th in the Cy Young voting.

I don't see K-Rod winning the Cy Young even if he breaks the record.

[Jigga]

Also, with all this discussion of how K-Rod should win the Cy Young if he gets the saves record let's not forget that when Bobby Thigpen got the single season saves record back in 1990 he finished 4th in the Cy Young voting.

I don't see K-Rod winning the Cy Young even if he breaks the record.

Bobby Thigpen didn't have a chance in hell of winning the Cy Young in 1990. Bob Welch led the Oakland A's to playoffs (and to the wrong end of a World Series sweep) with a ridiculous 27-6 won/loss record and a 2.95 ERA. He was dominant on the best team in the league. In 2008, we just don't have the same circumstances, but I don't think K-Rod will win the award anyway. When Eric Gagne won his Cy in 2003 over Jason Shmidt (17-5/2.34) and Mark Prior (18-6/2.43), who both put up really good numbers on first place teams, it wasn't just the saves. While he finished just shy of Thigpen's record (with 55 saves), it was the fact that dude was turn out the lights, lock the doors when you leave, and drive home safely dominant. No matter how many saves K-Rod gets, his 2008 just cannot compare to Gagne's 2003.

[mania]

I think what Putz did last year is a lot more impressive than what K-Rod's done this year, and he didn't even get a real look in the CY voting.

[Gary]

Potential 2008 NL Cy Young Award winner Brandon Webb goes on the mound today when he tries to win his 19th of the season when the Arizona Diamondbacks play the Padres

[Cujo]

Potential 2008 NL Cy Young Award winner Brandon Webb goes on the mound today when he tries to win his 19th of the season when the Arizona Diamondbacks play the Padres

Seeing how Dunn is starting to heat up as a D-Back and the fact that San Diego is freaking [Charles Barkley] turrble [/Chuck], Webby should get #19 tonight.

Also keeping the discussion out of the AL/NL East, the Cubs are simply uncatchable. The Brewers continue to play winning baseball, but are still losing ground in the NL Central to the Cubbies. Looks like Milwaukee should probably shift their attention to St. Louis and Philly and holding onto that NL Wild Card.

[Gary]

Potential 2008 NL Cy Young Award winner Brandon Webb goes on the mound today when he tries to win his 19th of the season when the Arizona Diamondbacks play the Padres

Seeing how Dunn is starting to heat up as a D-Back and the fact that San Diego is freaking [Charles Barkley] turrble [/Chuck], Webby should get #19 tonight.

Also keeping the discussion out of the AL/NL East, the Cubs are simply uncatchable. The Brewers continue to play winning baseball, but are still losing ground in the NL Central to the Cubbies. Looks like Milwaukee should probably shift their attention to St. Louis and Philly and holding onto that NL Wild Card.

Best bet for the Brew Crew is just keep winning, the Cards and Phils are hot on their trails. Plus it would be best for the Dodgers to keep on the heels of the Diamondbacks as well. No way in hell are they going to catch the Brewers, Cardinals or Phillies for that last spot

[DEAD!]

The Yankees must be desperate... they're are about to bring starting pitcher.... Carl Pavano?

[Brass]

The Yankees must be desperate... they're are about to bring starting pitcher.... Carl Pavano?

And to think I was slightly upset when the Red Sox lost out on him after the 2004 season....

[Jigga]

The Yankees must be desperate... they're are about to bring starting pitcher.... Carl Pavano?

And to think I was slightly upset when the Red Sox lost out on him after the 2004 season....

Hey, anyone can have a bad 4 years.

[CC97]

The Yankees must be desperate... they're are about to bring starting pitcher.... Carl Pavano?

And to think I was slightly upset when the Red Sox lost out on him after the 2004 season....

Hey, anyone can have a bad 4 years.

Yeah but they're usually elected

[Braden]

When your team can afford a Team-Coloured Segway, but doesn't pay the rent, you have a problem.

[OB33]

I'm not going disagree with what Braden just said (although they're wasting far more money on the person on the segway than on the segway itself) but I would like to point out the Nationals now have back to back wins against the Phillies and the Cubs.

Your move, Seattle.

[tp49]

The Yankees must be desperate... they're are about to bring starting pitcher.... Carl Pavano?

Come on Pavano won't make it out of the dugout for his first start before going back onto the disabled list.

[Breakwood]

11-0 makes me happy!

[Jigga]

Props to Carl Pavano on his first win in...for-freaking-ever.

[LMU]

The Rays just got jobbed out. How do the umps not notice that AJ threw an elbow at Aybar during a rundown, let alone give him another base in the process?

[njmeadowlanders]

Mr. Met Gives Throat Slash Sign to Yankee Fan