North American Pro Soccer 2015

[bosrs1]

Minnesota United going to MLS.

Glad it's not the Vikings bid. Disappointed this weakens the NASL.

Wow have to say I'm surprised that MLS didn't go with the NFL backed bid. But yeah not good news for NASL. Another market lost... and to MLS of all places. I'm really starting to wonder if there's a future in US Soccer for NASL with the new USL/MLS partnership and with NASL seemingly spinning their wheels on any kind of expansion. And it's just going to get worse when USL moves back up to D2.

[Gothamite]

Saddens me, but I don't see any way the NASL survives. Not unless they merge with USL or something.

It doesn't surprise me in the slightest that they chose Minnesota United's bid over the Vikings', if the reports are in fact true. MLS would much rather play in SSS than half-tarped NFL stadiums. And with the owners of the Twins and Timberwolves joining the bid, it's not like they'll be undercapitalized.

[2001mark]

Minnesota United going to MLS.

Glad it's not the Vikings bid. Disappointed this weakens the NASL.

'Minnesota United'... weird name.

[dfwabel]

Saddens me, but I don't see any way the NASL survives. Not unless they merge with USL or something.

It doesn't surprise me in the slightest that they chose Minnesota United's bid over the Vikings', if the reports are in fact true. MLS would much rather play in SSS than half-tarped NFL stadiums. And with the owners of the Twins and Timberwolves joining the bid, it's not like they'll be undercapitalized.

Just read the Star Tribune story. The five year window which Wulff has seems to make public financing difficult.

http://m.startribune.com/sports/296080511.html?section=sports/soccer

The lottery pull tab fiasco with the Vikings stadium doesn't help either, plus the state legislature has its general session every other year.

[pcgd]

Saddens me, but I don't see any way the NASL survives. Not unless they merge with USL or something.

Good thing you jumped off that ship when you did eh?

I know there is room for The Armada, Strikers, Cosmos, Eleven, Scorpions, & Fury in the conversation. I just hope the MLS doesn't kill off the successes of the lower divisions. Especially when they say they want to "Build the game."

[MJWalker45]

Something tells me that some teams might move around once Minnesota moves up. Should be interesting. I was really hoping San Antonio would move up.

[-kj]

Keep in mind that the Minnesota "reports" are just that at this point.

Not that I'm not excited; I'm just trying to keep it all in perspective.

[FiddySicks]

Hopefully Sacramento still has a shot. It's gonna be a real piss off if they hold out on that bid for some lame non existent Miami squad that'll probably never materialize.

[Gothamite]

Minnesota United going to MLS.

Glad it's not the Vikings bid. Disappointed this weakens the NASL.

'Minnesota United'... weird name.

How so?

[Gothamite]

Saddens me, but I don't see any way the NASL survives. Not unless they merge with USL or something.

Good thing you jumped off that ship when you did eh?

I know there is room for The Armada, Strikers, Cosmos, Eleven, Scorpions, & Fury in the conversation. I just hope the MLS doesn't kill off the successes of the lower divisions. Especially when they say they want to "Build the game."

I really thought the Cosmos would be NY2. Didn't work out that way.

I don't see anything wrong with teams in successful markets moving up to MLS. The trick is finding good smaller markets to replace them.

Keeping Minnesota out of the top level doesn't grow the game. Moving them up and getting

Milwaukee or St. Louis or San Diego to take their place in the second division sure does.

[TBGKon]

I was intrigued by the following....not only because Tampa Bay is a possibility but I agree Miami has shown no signs of true ownership.

http://worldsoccertalk.com/2015/03/11/time-for-mls-to-look-beyond-miami-for-second-florida-soccer-team/

[Gothamite]

I agree Miami has shown no signs of true ownership.

Nonsense. Miami has ownership. That's all they have, but they have it in spades. A group of deep-pocketed, savvy businessmen with roots in the game and an established track record of building brands, setting popular trends and running multi-billion dollar businesses. Heck, one of them is even local.

I'm hard-pressed to see what more you could want from a potential ownership group.

As for the article, the good points he makes about Tampa Bay are almost entirely undercut by his assertion that Jacksonville should also be in the conversation. It's bordering on absurd, since they haven't even played a single game and have no plans to build a soccer-specific stadium.

[TBGKon]

Jacksonville shouldn't have been brought into the story, but as a first year team that's why I think they were brought up.

My apologies for the confusion on the Miami situation, guess I had the variables mixed up. I do think they'll have a rough time getting a stadium after the Marlins Park debacle.

[pcgd]

But if you somehow kill off Indy, NY Cosmos, Scorpions, the Armada, Strikers, and Rowdies you certainly slow the growth of the game. Outside of Sacramento and including Rochester, those are the next best draws nationwide. They've already killed the Silverbacks, hopefully they can move to a desireable market and be replaced at the USL level for the Atlanta affiliate team.

IMO, In a perfect world without Pro/Rel, the US Soccer association steps in and cleans up the D2, D3 mess and actually puts teams in the divisons that make sense for them in terms of financial and attendence success. So D2 is now Sacramento (if not "promoted"), Indy, NY Cosmos, Rochester, Tampa Bay, Carolina, Ottawa, Strikers, OKC Energy, St. Louis, Louisville, Jacksonville, and if these happen maybe LA Aztecs, Chicago Sting, San Diego. (I'm probably missing some good USL teams and some possible expansion teams) If you only get 15 teams that work at that level right now, so be it. D3 is all the reserve teams plus pro teams like Harrisburg, Wilmington, and Pittsburgh, Colorado Springs, Tulsa, etc.

Then you can do modified Pro/Rel at the d2/3 level where the teams can apply based on a variety of factors including stadium size, financials, on field performance and attendence on 3-5 year averages and can also be bumped down for slipping. (Heck I'd say do that at the D1 level but it'd be definatly more extreme cases like Chivas.) Those smaller D3 clubs can move up to D2 to continue filling that level. D4 and below is amature or at most semi-pro (which lets be honest, many D2 and D3 are already that) Affiliations can be made between any teams if they want.

I'd rather the US Soccer Association running things than each league competing. That's what I don't think is in the best interests of American Soccer. I do like the MLS and I normally defend it and want it to succeed, but I don't have a team in the hunt so it limits me caring about it too greatly. Right now they are running everything outside of the NASL teams instead of USA Soccer which only benifits the shareholders of SUM (Soccer United Marketing, the MLS Marketing arm) and MLS. I don't care for the way its structured, Its time for the training wheels to come off and the teams need to be run independently with restrictions like Salary Caps/Floors. Single entity was a neccesity and its the only reason the MLS is where it today. But its going to stay where it is today on a world market unless the structure changes significantly.

BTW on the expansion teams I previously said, LA Aztecs at the NASL level I'm not sure could work, the market is huge and I think they can sustain a D2 side but its not a slam dunk. I prerfer San Diego/Bay Area/Las Vegas for NASL expansion out West. But I do believe the Chicago Sting could work in Chicago if its in the right location in the city. Its very similar to the NY Red Bulls situation where I think at the 2nd Divison level, a 2nd team could do VERY well.

[Gothamite]

But if you somehow kill off Indy, NY Cosmos, Scorpions, the Armada, Strikers, and Rowdies you certainly slow the growth of the game.

But who is proposing that? If the NASL folds, there's little doubt that the stronger teams can and would be absorbed into USL or whatever took the NASL's place as the second division.

You mention the Silverbacks. If they are truly done, as we suspect, it's because Atlanta got top-flight soccer. That's good for growing the game in Atlanta. And the Silverbacks are free to move to another, underserved market. That's good for growing the game there.

So yes, careful and measured MLS expansion is very good for the growth of the sport.

[pcgd]

I do get what you're saying and you aren't wrong at all. But you are looking at it from a fan of a MLS team vs. a fan of a NASL team. If you were still a Cosmos fan you'd have some of the same fears and uncertainty I'm sure. I will give this to the MLS, it certainly provides stablity in the short and mid-term. (Long term isn't there yet considering its a 20 year old league)

Yes, nobody's proposing killing those teams off, but actions speak louder than proposals. Again, I'm happy that if the NASL has to lose the Minnesota market, its because the United are moved up vs. the MLS coming to town and killing the team like in Atlanta. I would have much preferered the Silverbacks be "promoted" vs. destroyed. You can't deny that the MLS poaching Minnesota, Atlanta, New York, to a lesser extent Miami/Ft. Lauderdale and a way lesser extent Tampa Bay/Orlando (there have been some departures from the Rowdies to Orlando City) weakens the NASL and makes their fans say "WTF? The last 4.5 expansion teams are in NASL markets!" The more markets that move out of NASL, It certainly puts things up in the air and nothing is 100% that the USL or whatever could absorb all of them. Believe me the instability comes up when discussing soccer here in Indy when it comes to the stadium conversation (public funding debate put aside.) I've heard a number of times online (I know...) when discusing the Cosmos that the NASL is losing markets and therefore it kills the viabilty of them.

And yes they could go USL and I'm sure most if not all would be welcomed with open arms, but I still don't buy that a league built of half reserve teams can be that viable. Minor league baseball does well attendance wise, but you never hear anyone say they're a "fan of the Mudcats" because nobody really cares about minor league baseball when it comes to wins and losses. I'd hate for that to happen to lower division soccer.

I just believe all this competition between leagues does not help overall and I know NASL is somewhat responsible for that because they rejected the MLS partnership previously. But its kind of a hard place to be: Partner or prepare for war. I'm of course exaggerating but that's more or less what it is. The USL saw the writing on the wall and knew they couldn't survive without the MLS, the NASL is making a go of it alone. Its still possible they can succeed and I hope they do. I like that model much better but its going to be much harder.

[Needschat]

Will Minnesota United be called the Minnesota Loons once in MLS?

[smith03]

never mind

[BlackBolt3]

*still holds out hope for Carolina Railhawks move up that's never going to happen*

[Norva]

Will Minnesota United be called the Minnesota Loons once in MLS?

I certainly hope so.