In search of Larry O'Brien: 2015 NBA Playoffs

[See Red]

Honestly, if the Cavs finish this off, are there really any arguments left for Jordan being better than LeBron? Jordan had stacked teams and the greatest coach in NBA history when he rang, and couldn't even get past the first round when he had supporting casts and coaches of the quality that LeBron has been dragging to the Finals.

Jordan better will be the majority opinion and 6-0 vs. 3-3 will be the primary argument.

I am not saying I agree, as there is much nuance/circumstances in those records, but not only will most consider Bron behind Jordan, but behind Kobe too.

I think you're right. But Jordan's era was somewhat weak -- at least during the second three-peat. He never had to contend with anything like the Spurs of the past decade or so. For that reason, the rings argument doesn't hold up.

As I said earlier in this thread, I think it's way more likely that LeBron would be as great as he is (or better) in Jordan's era than it is that Jordan would be as great as he was in LeBron's era. How the hell would you defend LeBron with the way the rules for defense were back then?

The one thing I'd like to see from LeBron, though, is the killer instinct Jordan had. Him and the Cavs milking the clock in the 4th with a lead and settling for bad shots is going to bite them in the ass eventually. Would love to see him take it to the rim and go for the jugular in one of these games.

I think a lot of people will continue to make the argument for Jordan because of his brand.

[CubsFanBudMan]

Let LeBron's career play out. These Finals aren't even done yet. Why does a 2-1 lead mean anything to his legacy?

Is the argument that if his career ended today he's better than Jordan? I disagree.

And if that's not the argument... anything else is ifs, projection and speculation. Let him play. Enjoy the ride. Put it in context later... when you have context.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

Honestly, if the Cavs finish this off, are there really any arguments left for Jordan being better than LeBron? Jordan had stacked teams and the greatest coach in NBA history when he rang, and couldn't even get past the first round when he had supporting casts and coaches of the quality that LeBron has been dragging to the Finals.

Jordan better will be the majority opinion and 6-0 vs. 3-3 will be the primary argument.

I am not saying I agree, as there is much nuance/circumstances in those records, but not only will most consider Bron behind Jordan, but behind Kobe too.

This Kobe fan thinks LeBron is better than Kobe. They're different types of players though, but as a whole, LeBron has to be considered one of the top 5 players of all-time and better than Kobe was. Don't get me wrong, Kobe is one of the greatest scorers of all-time and to me, well-rounded enough to be one of the top 10 players of all-time. LeBron is just better though.

Let's see how these Finals end up. I'm in camp Kobe, but would probably flip my opinion if the Cavs win this series. I don't think the 08-10 Lakers were the greatest team of all time, but they easily had more raw talent than Tristan Thompson and Matthew "Delladanova." And while the 00-02 Lakers wouldn't have won without Kobe, they also had the greatest center since Abdul-Jabbar.

If you're drawing a line of greatest players in the NBA, you go from Bill Russell to Wilt to Kareem to Magic and Bird to Jordan to Shaq to Duncan to Kobe (or the other way around) to LeBron. Kobe was either clearly the best player in the NBA or in the top five from about 2000 through 2010. LeBron has been the very best player since he went to Miami, and I don't think it's close.

Finally, FWIW, I watched Dellavedova play with the Cavs during the regular season. He was in their regular rotation, probably more so after Waiters left the team (remember that mess?). He wasn't a scrub then -- he hit threes, played pesky defense, and was a productive sub. No one could have predicted he'd be as valuable as he was in the playoffs, but it's not like he's a guy who never got any minutes either. Per basketball reference, he started 13 of 67 games he played in, and hit 40% of his 3 pointers. His per 36 number was 8.8 points. So he was always a productive role player; I think having nothing to lose is working for him.

EDIT: Whenever Bill Simmons gets to broadcast again, I'd love to hear his thoughts on these Finals. This is the perfect series for him; it sucks he doesn't get to talk about it.

[DaRadniz29]

The Warriors are somewhat okay with LeBron James getting 40 points a game, it's somewhat by design. What they're not okay with is the 8 assists (also Dellavedova being that involved in the game). Now do they want those 30 points to come that easily? No, probably not. You also have to consider that those 8 assists turned into probably 20 points. Take away three of those assists and you might have been looking at a Warriors win or 3rd Overtime. In addition, Curry had been cold for seven quarters and Barnes and Thompson weren't as on as the usually are. He seemed to have heated up in the 4th Quarter of Game 3. We'll see if he has found his stroke again in Game 4.

i'm a little nervous for Game 4, but I don't expect Curry to be cold for a third game in a row and Thompson and Barnes should find their range again. What the Warriors can take away from the Games 2 & 3 losses is that as poorly as the played and shot, they sent game 2 to Overtime, and had their chances late in Game 3. If Curry and/or Warriors played even slightly better in those two games we could be looking at a different series.

It is what it is, and the Warriors are down 2-1 in the series. Time for the Warriors to rise up and show their strength in numbers.

[Unocal]

if you dont have a team in this series How can you not root for this Cavs team?

1. The Warriors are hardly a team easy to root against- they're not exactly bad guys themselves.

2. JR Smith. I don't want to see him get a ring.

3. David Blatt, basically the basketball version of Barry Switzer 20 years ago with the Cowboys

[Lights Out]

1. The Warriors are hardly a team easy to root against- they're not exactly bad guys themselves.

It's extremely easy to root against Draymond and Bogut, as well as the fawning media coverage that team gets. Even Curry has an annoying on-court demeanor even though he's pretty low-key off the court.

[DarkJourney]

1. The Warriors are hardly a team easy to root against- they're not exactly bad guys themselves.

It's extremely easy to root against Draymond and Bogut, as well as the fawning media coverage that team gets. Even Curry has an annoying on-court demeanor even though he's pretty low-key off the court.

The Clippers are such angels.

[CLEstones]

Sorry, but the people continuing to NOT give David Blatt SOME credit are completely ignorant. The guy has put game plan after game plan together against vastly different teams through each round of the Playoffs. Not once in the Playoffs has he been out coached - something I don't think you can say about Steve Kerr at this point. His defensive schemes are fantastic. And he continues to make adjustments in game, at half time, and between games that frankly aren't getting matched by Golden State (to be fair, Golden State just needs to get some shots to fall and they don't need to make adjustments).

All that being said, there is the LeBron factor. I think LeBron has been very, VERY good. I think some people are overstating what he is actually doing because the Cavs are up 2-1. His all around game has elevated. His shooting and decision making has been questionable - except for last night where, ehm, David Blatt, put a good game plan together to get LeBron in the right positions on the floor, against match ups he can exploit in the post. I think people are understating the impact of the supporting cast. Yes, this supporting cast doesn't have the big names like Wade, Bosh, Pippen, or Shaq... but this team is far from scrubs. Shumpert, Smith, Thompson and Mozgov would all be starters or rotation players in most of the NBA. Delly... he's a scrub. Guys like Mike Miller and James Jones are putting it all on the line, diving on the floor for loose balls (read: dirty players, i.e. Delly), and giving everything they have for the limited time they are playing.

This is by far a worse supporting cast than Jordan has EVER had. But let's not get it twisted, everyone NOT named LeBron is doing a hell of a job contributing and playing their asses off. And that includes David Blatt.

[OnWis97]

The shame is that if Golden State wins, how will this be remembered for LeBron in 10 years? That he did not get it done. And that's it.

[infrared41]

3. David Blatt, basically the basketball version of Barry Switzer 20 years ago with the Cowboys

Because Blatt took over a team that was stacked with future Hall of Famers and had won two titles in three years?

[NJTank]

LeBron James is the coach of the Cavs

[NJTank]

Talk about leaving it on the court

http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2015/story/_/id/13049783/matthew-dellavedova-cleveland-cavaliers-hospitalized-cramps

[CLEstones]

LeBron James is the coach of the Cavs

Ignorant. Or just flat out don't know anything about basketball. I can't decide which. Maybe sarcasm. Not sure.

[PSUcelticsWON95]

if you dont have a team in this series How can you not root for this Cavs team?

1. The Warriors are hardly a team easy to root against- they're not exactly bad guys themselves.

2. JR Smith. I don't want to see him get a ring.

3. David Blatt, basically the basketball version of Barry Switzer 20 years ago with the Cowboys

I find it hard to root for the Cavs. I understand that it's essentially a Cinderella Story right now, but I just can't find myself voting for LeBron. He's a fantastic player, and I respect him most of the time he's on the court, but he's just not a likeable guy to me.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

LeBron James is the coach of the Cavs

Ignorant. Or just flat out don't know anything about basketball. I can't decide which. Maybe sarcasm. Not sure.

Eh, I think there's a 1A and 1B hierarchy there.

I bet LeBron has more freedom to call and redraw plays than most NBA players. I also trust Brian Windhorst, who reported at midseason (when the Cavs stunk) that the players ignored Blatt in the huddle and and looked to James or Lue.

Clearly, they've worked it out. And I bet the renewed defensive pressure is a result of Blatt's planning. And in any event, he seems to have a functioning brain and motor skills, which is more than I can comfortably say for Mike Brown.

[dfwabel]

if you dont have a team in this series How can you not root for this Cavs team?

1. The Warriors are hardly a team easy to root against- they're not exactly bad guys themselves.

2. JR Smith. I don't want to see him get a ring.

3. David Blatt, basically the basketball version of Barry Switzer 20 years ago with the Cowboys

He's a fantastic player, and I respect him most of the time he's on the court, but he's just not a likeable guy to me.

You hate harder than Amin Elhassan.

Outside of ,"The Decision", what has he ever done in his career, from child star to now which makes him unlikeable? He acts like he's overly exhausted for your taste?

[TheRicSlick]

Guys, Lebron is the coach and GM of the Cavs.

[NJTank]

Even on the Bulls with Phil Jackson Michael Jordan was somewhat of a coach. He would tell Phil who he wanted on the court and when.

LeBron does the same thing and its not a knock on him its the fact that he is such a leader his voice is the most important on the bench and on the floor.

[Sport]

The shame is that if Golden State wins, how will this be remembered for LeBron in 10 years? That he did not get it done. And that's it.

Yeah and that sucks. I blame First Take. We live in Skip Bayless and Stephen A. Smith's world now where either you win it all and you're elite and you're on the Mount Rushmore of ____________ or you're human garbage wasting all of our time. There's no space for appreciating performances like this one from James.

I find it so funny that Skip so often talks about the legacies of certain athletes when he's tarnished his own so beyond repair.

[infrared41]

All the other silly stuff aside, I think this has been the most entertaining NBA Finals I've seen in quite a while. LBJ is putting on a performance for the ages.