Brett Favre

[illwauk]

Brady shouldn't be in the top 10. No way in Hell. If Peyton Manning had half the team(and scheme, and willingness to cheat) that Brady has, he'd have seven rings by now. Hell, that goes for several other quarterbacks in the league right now. Eli Manning, Carson Palmer, Donovan McNabb and Brett Favre; just to name a few off the top of my head.

As you can tell, I never punched my ticket to the Brady Bandwagon.

Brady is better than every QB you mentioned in your rant. He's one of the all-time greats. Deal with it. And as I have mentioned before, I am no fan of Boston sports but facts are facts.

The facts are that Brady hasn't done squat without Belichick. Dude didn't even start in college. The Patriots' success has a heck of a lot more to do with Belichick than it will ever have to do with Brady.

You take Brady out of the picture, and the Pats will still win ten or more games.

You take Manning out of the picture and the Colts are ed. Same with all those other quarterbacks and their respective teams. I'm not saying Brady's a bad quarterback. He just gets WAAAAAY too much of the credit.

As far as I'm concerned, he's NOT one of the all-time greats. He's good, but not great. His team would still make the playoffs with any other quarterback in the league. The Pats win because of Bill Belichick. Not Brady.

OK, what has Favre done without Holmgren? What did Bradshaw do without Noll? Staubach without Landry? Starr without Lombardi? Manning without Dungy? If that's your argument then Joe Montana is the only QB who deserves any credit at all. He actually won a SB under two different coaches. As I said before if he were Tom Brady 3 time SB winning QB of The Jacksonville Jaguars or Arizona Cardinals there would be no debate.

Here's how entirely -ed this debate is, I am one of the biggest Boston sports bashers on this board and here I am defending Brady. I never said he was the greatest ever but to say he is not among the best to ever play is just stupid. Are you people actually watching the same NFL I am? The arguments against him seem to have a lot more to do with animosity than they do with his actual performance.

Well.. he did take the Packers to the NFCC in (what was supposed to be) a rebuilding year. That's at least something...

Brett was definetly the best QB of the 90's. He might not have as many rings as Aikman or any more than Steve Young, but he also didn't have another hall-of-famer on offense (Aikman had Emmitt Smith and Michael Irvin, Young had Rice... although I could make a pretty good argument that William Henderson belongs in the hall... that's for another time).

That said... to say Brady isn't better is ridiculous. Brett exceeded the expectations of his era. Brady helped change them in his.

[rams80]

Like it or not, Brady is the Joe Montana of this era.

Had Tom Brady led the Pats past the Giants in Super Bowl XLII, I would be in total agreement with you.

However, Brady failed in "the big one" -- something Joe Cool never did.

So by only winning 3 titles, he doesn't deserve the accolades? I don't get the entire line of reasoning.

I think it's more the fact that he lost one title....or his teams have blown it in the clutch the last two years without their glorious kicker.

As much as I am loathe to admit it...and I do despise him personally...Brady is one of the best quarterbacks the league has seen when it comes to winning games. For example, the fact that he went from being a Trent Dilfer style "do one or two good things, don't up the rest, and let the defense win the game" QB to one of the major components of an offensive machine is a remarkable display of versatility.

Now...can we please get back to discussing Favre?

[Cujo]

Like it or not, Brady is the Joe Montana of this era.

Had Tom Brady led the Pats past the Giants in Super Bowl XLII, I would be in total agreement with you.

However, Brady failed in "the big one" -- something Joe Cool never did.

So by only winning 3 titles, he doesn't deserve the accolades? I don't get the entire line of reasoning.

I get it:

Curt's a Jets fan.

Brady plays for the Pats.

No. I'm saying Brady isn't equal to the greatest quarterback of all-time -- not yet.

Get back to me when Tom Terrific wins his 4th Super Bowl, 3rd Super Bowl MVP, 2nd regular season MVP, and can win a Super Bowl game by more than a field goal.

Thank you.

[Jigga]

Like it or not, Brady is the Joe Montana of this era.

Had Tom Brady led the Pats past the Giants in Super Bowl XLII, I would be in total agreement with you.

However, Brady failed in "the big one" -- something Joe Cool never did.

So by only winning 3 titles, he doesn't deserve the accolades? I don't get the entire line of reasoning.

I think it's more the fact that he lost one title....or his teams have blown it in the clutch the last two years without their glorious kicker.

As much as I am loathe to admit it...and I do despise him personally...Brady is one of the best quarterbacks the league has seen when it comes to winning games. For example, the fact that he went from being a Trent Dilfer style "do one or two good things, don't up the rest, and let the defense win the game" QB to one of the major components of an offensive machine is a remarkable display of versatility.

Now...can we please get back to discussing Favre?

Fixed.

[infrared41]

Brady shouldn't be in the top 10. No way in Hell. If Peyton Manning had half the team(and scheme, and willingness to cheat) that Brady has, he'd have seven rings by now. Hell, that goes for several other quarterbacks in the league right now. Eli Manning, Carson Palmer, Donovan McNabb and Brett Favre; just to name a few off the top of my head.

As you can tell, I never punched my ticket to the Brady Bandwagon.

Brady is better than every QB you mentioned in your rant. He's one of the all-time greats. Deal with it. And as I have mentioned before, I am no fan of Boston sports but facts are facts.

The facts are that Brady hasn't done squat without Belichick. Dude didn't even start in college. The Patriots' success has a heck of a lot more to do with Belichick than it will ever have to do with Brady.

You take Brady out of the picture, and the Pats will still win ten or more games.

You take Manning out of the picture and the Colts are ed. Same with all those other quarterbacks and their respective teams. I'm not saying Brady's a bad quarterback. He just gets WAAAAAY too much of the credit.

As far as I'm concerned, he's NOT one of the all-time greats. He's good, but not great. His team would still make the playoffs with any other quarterback in the league. The Pats win because of Bill Belichick. Not Brady.

OK, what has Favre done without Holmgren? What did Bradshaw do without Noll? Staubach without Landry? Starr without Lombardi? Manning without Dungy? If that's your argument then Joe Montana is the only QB who deserves any credit at all. He actually won a SB under two different coaches. As I said before if he were Tom Brady 3 time SB winning QB of The Jacksonville Jaguars or Arizona Cardinals there would be no debate.

Here's how entirely -ed this debate is, I am one of the biggest Boston sports bashers on this board and here I am defending Brady. I never said he was the greatest ever but to say he is not among the best to ever play is just stupid. Are you people actually watching the same NFL I am? The arguments against him seem to have a lot more to do with animosity than they do with his actual performance.

Well.. he did take the Packers to the NFCC in (what was supposed to be) a rebuilding year. That's at least something...

Brett was definetly the best QB of the 90's. He might not have as many rings as Aikman or any more than Steve Young, but he also didn't have another hall-of-famer on offense (Aikman had Emmitt Smith and Michael Irvin, Young had Rice... although I could make a pretty good argument that William Henderson belongs in the hall... that's for another time).

That said... to say Brady isn't better is ridiculous. Brett exceeded the expectations of his era. Brady helped change them in his.

I should add that I'm not knocking Favre at all. After The Browns, The Packers are one of my favorite teams to watch. I am a big fan of Favre's. My argument isn't about Brady vs. Favre. The whole point about Holmgren was someone's argument that Brady would be nothing without Bellichick.

[njmeadowlanders]

You fumble, you do a lap...

[infrared41]

You fumble, you do a lap...

But they're actually supposed to run right?

[BlueSky]

'What if' scenarios throughout history are kind of interesting. For example, what if there had been no tuck rule or if that play had been ruled a fumble? Is history any different for the Patriots other that not making the Super Bowl that year? Or could losing that game have affected Brady's confidence enough that he wouldn't have become the Brady we know today?

I guess the same could be said for Fav-ruh...what if Don Majkowski hadn't been injured? Maybe Brett would have become a career clipboard holder.

[CMUBrent]

You fumble, you do a lap...

I'm sure ESPN will be over-analyzing that all day long.

[Jigga]

You fumble, you do a lap...

But they're actually supposed to run right?

Brett Favre can do whatever he wants. Brett Favre is Brett Favre.

[TFoA]

Like it or not, Brady is the Joe Montana of this era.

Had Tom Brady led the Pats past the Giants in Super Bowl XLII, I would be in total agreement with you.

However, Brady failed in "the big one" -- something Joe Cool never did.

So by only winning 3 titles, he doesn't deserve the accolades? I don't get the entire line of reasoning.

I get it:

Curt's a Jets fan.

Brady plays for the Pats.

No. I'm saying Brady isn't equal to the greatest quarterback of all-time -- not yet.

Get back to me when Tom Terrific wins his 4th Super Bowl, 3rd Super Bowl MVP, 2nd regular season MVP, and can win a Super Bowl game by more than a field goal.

Thank you.

I was with ya til that. IMO, it doesn't matter how much you win it by, just as long as you win it.

But good points though. We'll have to see what happens in the future. I think he's got a shot at it.

[DEAD!]

You fumble, you do a lap...

But they're actually supposed to run right?

Brett Favre can do whatever he wants. Brett Favre is Brett Favre.

Yup... it's Brett being Brett...

[infrared41]

Like it or not, Brady is the Joe Montana of this era.

Had Tom Brady led the Pats past the Giants in Super Bowl XLII, I would be in total agreement with you.

However, Brady failed in "the big one" -- something Joe Cool never did.

So by only winning 3 titles, he doesn't deserve the accolades? I don't get the entire line of reasoning.

I get it:

Curt's a Jets fan.

Brady plays for the Pats.

No. I'm saying Brady isn't equal to the greatest quarterback of all-time -- not yet.

Get back to me when Tom Terrific wins his 4th Super Bowl, 3rd Super Bowl MVP, 2nd regular season MVP, and can win a Super Bowl game by more than a field goal.

Thank you.

I was with ya til that. IMO, it doesn't matter how much you win it by, just as long as you win it.

But good points though. We'll have to see what happens in the future. I think he's got a shot at it.

I didn't mean that Brady is as good as Joe Montana. What I meant was Brady is as close to Joe Montana as we're going to get in this era. Saying Brady is the Joe Montana of this era is entirely different from saying Brady is every bit as good as Joe Montana. He isn't and he never will be. Montana was the best ever. Period.

[njmeadowlanders]

'What if' scenarios throughout history are kind of interesting. For example, what if there had been no tuck rule or if that play had been ruled a fumble? Is history any different for the Patriots other that not making the Super Bowl that year? Or could losing that game have affected Brady's confidence enough that he wouldn't have become the Brady we know today?

I guess the same could be said for Fav-ruh...what if Don Majkowski hadn't been injured? Maybe Brett would have become a career clipboard holder.

Of course they're interesting. But every event in world history has led to the state of the world as it is today. If Hitler won the war, if the Redcoats beat the Americans, if the plague never hit Europe, if Jesus was never here, and on and on and on and on. Everything that exists as it does today may not exist had any one event in the past never happened. This could be good or bad.

But for every "what if Don Majkowski hadn't been injured?" question I could just as easily ask "What if Mo Lewis never knocked Drew Bledsoe out of that game?" or "What if Buckner didn't commit that error?" or "what if MJ never retired the first time around" and could come up with more until I'm blue in the face.

The fact of the matter is, Brett Favre has accomplished a TON during his career. That is what happened. You can't deny that. Facts are facts.

Now, is he the greatest thing since sliced bread? No. Is he even the best QB of his era? Probably not (Qualitatively, not quantitatively). But that's why we have our own opinions.

I personally don't think he's going to come to the Jets and take them to the Super Bowl or even past a wild-card berth (Which I felt was the limit w/ Pennington at the helm). He's not what the Jets need. It was a PR move first and foremost. Look how many people have bought Favre crap already and he's not even taken a meaningless preseason snap. All he's done is had the Jets steal the back page from the Soap Opera that is the Yankees for a few days and gotten the Jets more than their weekly 12 seconds of coverage on ESPN. That's why they did the trade. It will also help them when they unveil their evil PSL plan in a couple of weeks and then they can just keep saying "Well, we got Brett Favre". Spare me.

[Gothamite]

I personally don't think he's going to come to the Jets and take them to the Super Bowl or even past a wild-card berth (Which I felt was the limit w/ Pennington at the helm). He's not what the Jets need. It was a PR move first and foremost. Look how many people have bought Favre crap already and he's not even taken a meaningless preseason snap. All he's done is had the Jets steal the back page from the Soap Opera that is the Yankees for a few days and gotten the Jets more than their weekly 12 seconds of coverage on ESPN. That's why they did the trade.

And that alone makes it worthwhile.

[LMU]

For those wondering, EA Sports will be offering a printable replacement cover for Madden with Favre as a Jet, as well as a roster update. I'm assuming that the cover will be on the website.

The question now is if the curse applies to the Jets if the cover has to be printed by game owners.

[Jigga]

For those wondering, EA Sports will be offering a printable replacement cover for Madden with Favre as a Jet, as well as a roster update. I'm assuming that the cover will be on the website.

The question now is if the curse applies to the Jets if the cover has to be printed by game owners.

He was already cursed by having to go to the Jets.

[JQK]

(**) The Most Outstanding Post of this Thread (**)

He was already cursed by having to go to the Jets.

Congratulations!

[tBBP]

Brett Favre doesn't "fire" footballs when he throws them. Footballs are so afraid to be held by him that they fire themselves out of his hand at the first possible instant.

Seriously...that's what this whole debacle is going to turn into...a whole 'nother Chuck Norris type thing.

[JQK]

"No, you're eyes don't decieve you, Brett's Jets uniform is a shade off. Brett Favre is so tough, when he left Green Bay he took the green with him."