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Kurt Warner Retires...


CDixonDesign

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Honestly, I thought he'd go one final season. Kind of a shame his final game was such a blowout.

But on the other hand, Dan Marino's final game was a 62-7 loss to the Jacksonville Jaguars.

He had a great career, though, and really helped to make the Cardinals relevant again the past couple of seasons.

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Question for people that watched him more closely than me:

Obviously he was great in his early years with the Rams. Then he was eventually supplanged by Bulger, and relegated to backup. He pretty much sucked with the Giants, and then went to the Cards, where (IIRC) he wasn't even the starter at first. Then he was great again. Why did he suck inthe middle? Or did he really not suck, but there was some other reason he got benched and then sucked in NY?

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Question for people that watched him more closely than me:

Obviously he was great in his early years with the Rams. Then he was eventually supplanged by Bulger, and relegated to backup. He pretty much sucked with the Giants, and then went to the Cards, where (IIRC) he wasn't even the starter at first. Then he was great again. Why did he suck inthe middle? Or did he really not suck, but there was some other reason he got benched and then sucked in NY?

Hard to say, really. The only person who could really answer that question is Warner.

But remember... It's not just physical prowess or skill. It's also mental and team chemistry. Perhaps Warner's later years with the Rams and short stint with the Giants just didn't match him well against the other team players, creating bad chemistry. Teams can't win with just one or two good players, they win when those good players create good chemistry with the lesser players. (Look at how Manning's first year with the Colts was a disaster, and then how quickly his team improved.)

Obviously, Warner worked out very well with the Cards, because it had all the necessary components for success: Warner rediscovered his physical prowess, the Cards rebuilt their team around some younger players and Warner then had some adequate players he could throw the ball to.

Think about how good the Lakers were back in the early 2000s... Kobe, Shaq, Rick Fox, Derek Fisher, etc. They won three championships in a row, and they would have won again in 2003 except for bad team chemistry. The squabbles between Kobe and Shaq, bad mental attitudes, was all it took to doom the Lakers in '03. And then look what happened in '04... They signed many new all-stars and was a team loaded with NBA All-Stars players. And then they got destroyed by Detroit in the Finals. It's the same thing in the NFL... Sometimes players do badly because they don't work well with the team. You can't just put a bunch of Pro Bowlers together on a team and assume they'll win the Super Bowl.

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He's a fringe HOFer in my mind, he had some of the best Individual seasons and the three best Super Bowl performances but has years where he just can't put it altogether 2002-2006.

He still gets in before Ken Stabler and Jim Plunkett. That's even if they get nominated to get in.

Great career, great leader, great person I wish him the best.

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He's a fringe HOFer in my mind, he had some of the best Individual seasons and the three best Super Bowl performances but has years where he just can't put it altogether 2002-2006.

He still gets in before Ken Stabler and Jim Plunkett. That's even if they get nominated to get in.

Great career, great leader, great person I wish him the best.

Remember Joe Namath got in, and he had more INTs then TDs

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He's a fringe HOFer in my mind, he had some of the best Individual seasons and the three best Super Bowl performances but has years where he just can't put it altogether 2002-2006.

He still gets in before Ken Stabler and Jim Plunkett. That's even if they get nominated to get in.

Great career, great leader, great person I wish him the best.

Remember Joe Namath got in, and he had more INTs then TDs

Right or wrong, Namath probably would have made the HoF just for standing around on the sidelines in Super Bowl III. The fact that it's considered one of the biggets upsets in all of sports, let alone the NFL, and was made even more legendary with Namath's guarantee pretty much sealed his spot in the HoF.

I'm quite sure Warner will make the HoF. True, he had some bad years, but so did Namath. Every great QB is going to have down years. That's the nature of the game... Look how good the Rams were when Warner was there, and look where they are now. But one day, the Rams will be competitive again. Just like every player has up years and down years.

Unfortunately, most great players don't end their careers on a high note. To my knowledge, John Elway is still the only HoF'er to end his career after a Super Bowl victory.

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Unfortunately, most great players don't end their careers on a high note. To my knowledge, John Elway is still the only HoF'er to end his career after a Super Bowl victory.

Two in a row, no less. That just doesn't happen.

I'd put Warner slightly above "fringe HOFer". You can be a Hall of Famer and have a couple bad years - >cough, cough< FAVRE! >cough, cough< - especially when all those years can be traced to one stay in his career, I'd be more inclined to write them off as not being a good fit with the Giants.

When Warner got to the Rams, they were a laughingstock. He took them to two Super Bowls and won one of them. When Warner got to the Cardinals, they were a laughingstock. After he won the starting job, he took them to a Super Bowl. Once might have been a fluke, but twice says something about Warner as a quarterback.

Hey, if Warner's retiring, is he taking the wire-haired man-goblin with him?

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Question for people that watched him more closely than me:

Obviously he was great in his early years with the Rams. Then he was eventually supplanged by Bulger, and relegated to backup. He pretty much sucked with the Giants, and then went to the Cards, where (IIRC) he wasn't even the starter at first. Then he was great again. Why did he suck inthe middle? Or did he really not suck, but there was some other reason he got benched and then sucked in NY?

The Rams' offensive system under Mike Martz called for the QB to stand in the pocket for prolonged periods of time, leaving them open to hit after hit. Also during that "era" the Rams offensive line suffered through a slow, but noticeable deterioration, so the QB was getting hit more and more often. Eventually this culminated in Warner suffering from something not unlike PTSD due to the constant walloping of defender after defender, leaving him needing a few years to recover his confidence as a QB (read Giants career once Eli got the keys and early Cardinals career). It also didn't help that Warner :censored: ed up his throwing hand in 2002 and didn't give it enough chance to heal before 2003.

As this was going on, from 2002 onward the Rams were aware they had another QB in Marc Bulger who may have been slightly less good than Warner, but had taken far fewer hits and therefore did not have PTSD. Once Bulger gained enough seniority in the league that the Rams couldn't simply tender him at the veteran minimum and therefore cap issues forced the Rams to choose between Warner or Bulger, the Rams organization, recognizing that the future, as the cliche goes, is now, cut Warner loose and sent him off to recover somewhere, and made a go of winning now with Bulger.

Side note-the Rams made the right call in this instance IMO. They couldn't afford to wait 2 or 3 years to see if Warner would recover. And in all honesty, Warner probably wouldn't have recovered if he stayed in St. Louis; Bulger strongly resembles 2002-2003 Warner at the moment, only surrounded by less talent and even more abused by opposing defenders.

He owes a giant keg of near beer to Trent Green.

No, he owes the keg to Rodney Harrison. And a six pack to Will Witherspoon.

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Side note-the Rams made the right call in this instance IMO. They couldn't afford to wait 2 or 3 years to see if Warner would recover. And in all honesty, Warner probably wouldn't have recovered if he stayed in St. Louis; Bulger strongly resembles 2002-2003 Warner at the moment, only surrounded by less talent and even more abused by opposing defenders.

That's an awfully hard point to make. After Warner left, Bulger had a couple of very good seasons surrounded by decent, mediocre, and bad seasons. Kurt Warner took a few years to heal before becoming a dominant star again. The Rams won virtually nothing after making the move.

You can certainly argue it was the right call at the time. And you can argue that making the other call wouldn't have resulted in any better results. But given the results we've seen, it's hard to really say they made the right call. At best, there was no right call.

Because I said the entire time that choosing Marc Bulger over Kurt Warner was a mistake of epic proportions, I'll take the other side and say they absolutely made the wrong call at the time, and I think things would have played out substantially different if they'd have kept Kurt.

What I have going for me is the unknown. We know already know Marc Bulger didn't work out. (And by admitting I have the unknown going for me, I'm attempting to imply neither of us is really right or wrong. It's a situation where hindsight doesn't even really help.)

Onto Warner himself, I wish him luck in his future endeavors. One of the truly great people in sports and beyond. He's had a great career, definitely a HOFer. With better health, he might be one of the all-time greats. As it is, he's at least had a HOF career and played as well as any QB ever in certain points of that career.

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As a Larry Fitzgerald owner in a keeper, I'm sad to see him go. For my benefit, and Arizona's, let's hope Leinart isn't their solution.

I say give him a full year. He never really had a full year to do anything with the Cardinals. Once he got into the groove of the offense he was either benched or injured. I have a feeling it may be a rebuilding year as they are losing Berry, Warner and possibly Dockett and Boldin. They will still be on or near the top of the West, but I think this is the year for Leinart to step up for Arizona, or he may just be replaced by a draft pick or a veteran backup

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