Corvus Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Given the overall success on ice of the Jets, I'm not sure why a Coyotes fan would give a crap about the history of the team when it was in Winnipeg being returned there. We're not exactly talking about a wave of glory here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan33 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I like how so much time and energy is spent arguing over the history of mediocre to awful teams.The Coyotes never won a playoff series nor did the Thrashers and the Jets never advanced past the 2nd round. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the Jets only win three playoff series in their history? At least the Stars/North Stars argument concerns a team with a respectable history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rams80 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 As a modest point of order, the WHA-era Jets were kinda sort of awesome. On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said: You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now. On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said: Today, we are all otaku. "The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010 The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvus Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 As a modest point of order, the WHA-era Jets were kinda sort of awesome.True, but the NHL jets, well, there's a reason they were referred to as "Loser-peg" in some circles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 why can't their next-door neighbor Coyotes can't?"Why Can't The Coyotes Can't?": three years distilled into one sentence. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColeJ Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 this thread has gotten ridiculous.the coyotes are the jets. the jets left winnipeg, and are now in phoenix with a new name and logo.the thrashers will be moving to winnipeg, and getting their own new name. if they want to honor their history, and put up jets banners, they're more than welcome in my opinion.however, their all-time leading scorer will be ilya kovalchuk. not dale hawerchuk. they will not be the winnipeg jets, nor should they be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nash61 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 this thread has gotten ridiculous.the coyotes are the jets. the jets left winnipeg, and are now in phoenix with a new name and logo.the thrashers will be moving to winnipeg, and getting their own new name. if they want to honor their history, and put up jets banners, they're more than welcome in my opinion.however, their all-time leading scorer will be ilya kovalchuk. not dale hawerchuk. they will not be the winnipeg jets, nor should they be.I completely agree. The previous history of a team is property of the team that they now are.Jets->CoyotesWhalers->Hurricanes On September 20, 2012 at 0:50 AM, 'CS85 said: It's like watching the hellish undead creakily shuffling their way out of the flames of a liposuction clinic dumpster fire. On February 19, 2012 at 9:30 AM, 'pianoknight said: Story B: Red Wings go undefeated and score 100 goals in every game. They also beat a team comprised of Godzilla, the ghost of Abraham Lincoln, 2 Power Rangers and Betty White. Oh, and they played in the middle of Iraq on a military base. In the sand. With no ice. Santa gave them special sand-skates that allowed them to play in shorts and t-shirts in 115 degree weather. Jesus, Zeus and Buddha watched from the sidelines and ate cotton candy. POTD 5/24/12, POTD 2/26/17  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColeJ Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 this thread has gotten ridiculous.the coyotes are the jets. the jets left winnipeg, and are now in phoenix with a new name and logo.the thrashers will be moving to winnipeg, and getting their own new name. if they want to honor their history, and put up jets banners, they're more than welcome in my opinion.however, their all-time leading scorer will be ilya kovalchuk. not dale hawerchuk. they will not be the winnipeg jets, nor should they be.I completely agree. The previous history of a team is property of the team that they now are.Jets->CoyotesWhalers->Hurricanesagreed. unless there's some kind of pre-arranged agreement, like the browns and ravens, where they agree to leave their record books behind and act as an expansion team... but even that seems sort of silly. you can pretend to be expansion all you want, but if you're not, you're not. you're forever linked with your old city/identity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troy_3223 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I like how so much time and energy is spent arguing over the history of mediocre to awful teams.The Coyotes never won a playoff series nor did the Thrashers and the Jets never advanced past the 2nd round. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the Jets only win three playoff series in their history? At least the Stars/North Stars argument concerns a team with a respectable history.I'm having trouble following this and keeping it in context. Are we seriously trying to argue over the ownership of the vast and glorious history of the Winnipeg Jets, or are we just trying to goad poor BigMac12 into biblically losing his *expletive* one last time before the rapture takes him away? I'm game to join in either way, I just want to know what the stakes are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kw11333 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Would it be that big of a deal that the Coyotes hand over the Jets name and colours? They don't even have an owner, it is all league controlled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColeJ Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Would it be that big of a deal that the Coyotes hand over the Jets name and colours? They don't even have an owner, it is all league controlled.well winnipeg doesn't need permission to use jets COLORS... so that part isn't even relevant...but as far as the jets name goes, i guess if the coyotes agreed to it, it would be fine. it would seem a little weird since they're owned by the NHL to begin with, so it seems like a conflict of interest. but even then, the main issue with me isn't the logo and naming right. it's the team history. the coyotes can't hand over their team history and record books. otherwise they'd have to play revisionist history and give shane doan the franchise lead in points, and then try to figure out if they're going to count the points he scored in winnipeg, or if those records would belong to the thrashers/jets2.0 franchise.that's why the whole thing is stupid and overly complicated.no matter how hard we all wish the jets could come back to winnipeg, unless the JETS (now known as coyotes) actually moves back to winnipeg, it's not the same team. the atlanta thrashers are not the winnipeg jets.if by some fluke the nhl decides to use their temporary ownership of the coyotes franchise to strip the coyotes of their jets lineage, it would be in name only, and by that token, superficial.really, the only option here is to come up with a new team identity... or go with the incredibly AHL "manitoba moose" moniker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M4One Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 The team can be named Jets, but it just can't claim any of the history of the old Jets/Coyotes franchise. That means anything from the WHA days up to now. They can't put up Bobby Hull/Dale Hawerchuk/Thomas Steen's number in the rafters and honour them like it was part of their own. The new team in Winnipeg will share the history of the Atlanta Thrashers, or they can just leave all that in Atlanta and begin fresh.Had the Coyotes abandoned all of the Jets history when they left for Phoenix, the new Winnipeg Jets could conceivable reclaim that history much like the current Montreal Alouettes did when they moved from Baltimore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthStar74 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Had the Coyotes abandoned all of the Jets history when they left for Phoenix, the new Winnipeg Jets could conceivable reclaim that history much like the current Montreal Alouettes did when they moved from Baltimore.I have a CFL database for both MS Office and Excel.. and I do have both the Baltimore CFL Colts/Stallions win-loss-tie for regular and playoff seasons included in the current Montreal Alouettes record stats with some explanations like from 1987 to 1995 no mtl als team playing and etc.. I dunno as I want to be accurate as possible without confusing everything so far.. if the Thrashers does move from Atlanta to Winnipeg they would need to bring the Thrashers stats over there, not use the Jets/Coyotes stats, so best to start right and follow the history line somehow? Ice Hockey International Winnipeg Braves (Bobby Hull Division 18-3-0 1st place as of March 14, 2011)2010-11 O'Brien Trophy for Bobby Hull Division championship & Jack Riley Cup for top team in league regular season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 The team can be named Jets, but it just can't claim any of the history of the old Jets/Coyotes franchise. That means anything from the WHA days up to now. They can't put up Bobby Hull/Dale Hawerchuk/Thomas Steen's number in the rafters and honour them like it was part of their own.Sure they can. They can do whatever they want. Are we forgetting that on the other side of the Browns/Ravens equation, the Ravens traipse around as if they're the genuine reincarnation of the Baltimore Colts, with all the BaltColts alumni and marching band and so forth claiming that they're all in it together as Baltimore's NFL Team? It's all just a bunch of silly social constructs that can be molded and perverted any way the powers that be please. If it helps people sleep at night to contextualize the new team as a spiritual continuation of the Winnipeg Jets while the old Jets die in the desert like everybody else there with a half-assed Hawerchuk banner amidst the beer signs, then whatever. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMac12 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 The team can be named Jets, but it just can't claim any of the history of the old Jets/Coyotes franchise. That means anything from the WHA days up to now. They can't put up Bobby Hull/Dale Hawerchuk/Thomas Steen's number in the rafters and honour them like it was part of their own.Sure they can. They can do whatever they want. Are we forgetting that on the other side of the Browns/Ravens equation, the Ravens traipse around as if they're the genuine reincarnation of the Baltimore Colts, with all the BaltColts alumni and marching band and so forth claiming that they're all in it together as Baltimore's NFL Team? It's all just a bunch of silly social constructs that can be molded and perverted any way the powers that be please. If it helps people sleep at night to contextualize the new team as a spiritual continuation of the Winnipeg Jets while the old Jets die in the desert like everybody else there with a half-assed Hawerchuk banner amidst the beer signs, then whatever.Then who owns the history of the Thrashers if they move to Winnipeg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Left dormant in the event another team comes into town to resume it, I suppose. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMac12 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Left dormant in the event another team comes into town to resume it, I suppose.That's very foolish. The Jets franchise moved to Phoenix. The Thrashers franchise is a seperate entity with it's own history. Who then would be the Winnipeg scoring leader?I feel that ColeJ and nash61 has nailed this subject down pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M4One Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 The team can be named Jets, but it just can't claim any of the history of the old Jets/Coyotes franchise. That means anything from the WHA days up to now. They can't put up Bobby Hull/Dale Hawerchuk/Thomas Steen's number in the rafters and honour them like it was part of their own.Sure they can. They can do whatever they want. Are we forgetting that on the other side of the Browns/Ravens equation, the Ravens traipse around as if they're the genuine reincarnation of the Baltimore Colts, with all the BaltColts alumni and marching band and so forth claiming that they're all in it together as Baltimore's NFL Team? It's all just a bunch of silly social constructs that can be molded and perverted any way the powers that be please. If it helps people sleep at night to contextualize the new team as a spiritual continuation of the Winnipeg Jets while the old Jets die in the desert like everybody else there with a half-assed Hawerchuk banner amidst the beer signs, then whatever.In the end most people aren't going to care either way, anyways, as long as NHL hockey is back. I would expect them to bring back some old Jets greats to help them to kick off the season and you can celebrate that. I guess I'm more talking about the win/loss record and how that sticks with Phoenix and its the Thrashers' win/loss and zero playoff wins that would follow them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rvrdgsfn Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 If Winnipeg comes back as the moose, please make these your 3rd...Uploaded with ImageShack.us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lights Out Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Ditch the roundel (there's too many third sweaters with roundels in the NHL) and that'd look nice. POTD: 2/4/12 3/4/12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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