2013 MLB Discussion Thread, Redux

[cmm]

It's a shame most people will remember Joyce for that one blown call. He's one of the best.

EDIT: Just saw this rule comment referenced on ESPN:

Rule 2.00 (Obstruction) Comment: If a fielder is about to receive a thrown ball and if the ball

is in flight directly toward and near enough to the fielder so he must occupy his position to receive the

ball he may be considered “in the act of fielding a ball.” It is entirely up to the judgment of the umpire

as to whether a fielder is in the act of fielding a ball. After a fielder has made an attempt to field a ball

and missed, he can no longer be in the “act of fielding” the ball. For example: an infielder dives at a

ground ball and the ball passes him and he continues to lie on the ground and delays the progress of

the runner, he very likely has obstructed the runner.

[Kramerica Industries]

I try to think of Jim Joyce as the one with the ridiculous pipes when calling balls and strikes.

But going back to 2010 and the perfect game, one of the biggest problems we tend to have with umps is how they hide and don't show accountability. Well, Joyce showed accountability and then some that night, and re-affirmed the respect that the Tigers and the rest of baseball have for him. Excellent umpire.

[BBTV]

Whether it's the right call "by the book" or not, it's garbage that any major-league game, let alone a WS game ends like that. I have no rooting interest in this series (other than I think that STL Fanatic is completely irrational, and McCall is an inbred imbecile so I kinda always hope that STL loses) but that's absolutely not the way a WS game should end.

[dbadefense1990]

Upon reviewing the play, you'll notice Joyce makes no signal for obstruction until Middlebrooks shot his legs up. This is very clear. Middlebrooks on the ground was not the mistake - it was Middlebrooks lifting his legs up, causing Craig to trip, that brought about the call.

Right call.

So is if safe to assume that if Middlebrooks had laid flat on his stomach and all Craig had to do was hop over him, there'd be no interference call and the play at home would have counted? What if Craig still tripped over Middlebrooks, but the 3rd base runner didn't lift his legs up (Craig tripped on his own because he didn't see Middlebrooks)?

[worcat]

Per his interview on Foxsports Salty accused Craig of running out of the base line first. wtf....

[Kramerica Industries]

But what's the solution, then? There's the idea of "referees/umps deciding the game", but it's a flawed idea; officials in a sport decide the game through not only the calls they make, but also the calls they don't make. That's an obstruction there; should Joyce have just not done anything about that? The Cardinals would have a legit beef afterwards if they don't end up winning this game.

I mean, no, I don't like a game ending that way, but I don't like when the European Cup or FIFA World Cup ends in PKs, either. Sometimes, it just becomes a necessary evil.

[FiddySicks]

Per his interview on Foxsports Salty accused Craig of running out of the base line first. wtf....

He was an idiot for even making that throw.

[worcat]

Upon reviewing the play, you'll notice Joyce makes no signal for obstruction until Middlebrooks shot his legs up. This is very clear. Middlebrooks on the ground was not the mistake - it was Middlebrooks lifting his legs up, causing Craig to trip, that brought about the call.

Right call.

So is if safe to assume that if Middlebrooks had laid flat on his stomach and all Craig had to do was hop over him, there'd be no interference call and the play at home would have counted? What if Craig still tripped over Middlebrooks, but the 3rd base runner didn't lift his legs up (Craig tripped on his own because he didn't see Middlebrooks)?

I believe this is correct. Had he just layed there I think it'd be ok?

Also LAST time a game ended in this call was 1974.

[LMU]

Equating this to pro wrestling, this is reminiscent of the face champ being laid out by a steel chair in a no DQ match and Jim Ross screaming at the top of his lungs "BAH GAWD, KING, NOT LIKE THIS! NOT LIKE THIS!"

[worcat]

Has not been mentioned but did anyone consider why Yadi didn't lay into Salty to try to win the game? Pretty classy if you ask me - from catcher to catcher and not trying to injure either one.

[McCall]

Has not been mentioned but did anyone consider why Yadi didn't lay into Salty to try to win the game? Pretty classy if you ask me - from catcher to catcher and not trying to injure either one.

I don't believe we're allowed to say anything good about the Cardinals.

[McCall]

Whether it's the right call "by the book" or not, it's garbage that any major-league game, let alone a WS game ends like that. I have no rooting interest in this series (other than I think that STL Fanatic is completely irrational, and McCall is an inbred imbecile so I kinda always hope that STL loses) but that's absolutely not the way a WS game should end.

So it doesn't end the way you want and therefore it's wrong? What's the matter, can't handle disagreement?

[worcat]

Has not been mentioned but did anyone consider why Yadi didn't lay into Salty to try to win the game? Pretty classy if you ask me - from catcher to catcher and not trying to injure either one.

I don't believe we're allowed to say anything good about the Cardinals.

Yeah I know, but I'm just saying, he literally slid multiple feet from home...worst slide ever.

I was disappointed at first, but looking back its either lazy or classy. I'm trying to find a middle ground, not being a typical fake STL fan.

[CS85]

Has not been mentioned but did anyone consider why Yadi didn't lay into Salty to try to win the game? Pretty classy if you ask me - from catcher to catcher and not trying to injure either one.

I don't believe we're allowed to say anything good about the Cardinals.

Right you are.

[cmm]

I can't recall ever seeing a runner attempt to knock over a catcher on an infield grounder when he's out by a mile like Molina was.

[worcat]

I can't recall ever seeing a runner attempt to knock over a catcher on an infield grounder when he's out by a mile like Molina was.

I realize that, but it's the World Series, not game 154.

[DaytonBlue]

Players probably weren't watching because they were trying to throw out Craig. Plus it was pretty loud. As in game 1, they got the call right. That's what matters, right?

Exactly. As a Cards fan, I was embarrassed by some fans on other sites saying that out by Kozma should have counted because the original call was an out. Tonight a big call went in STL's favor. And they both were correct.

This is more a problem in other sports, but the rules should be the rules all the time so I don't buy the argument that the call shouldn't have been made just because it was the last play of a game (much bigger issue in the GDNHL and NBA IMHO). Yes, we want the players to play, but sports aren't like Family Feud where the last couple rounds count double and the team behind can always catch up.

I have to say for the last two teams left we've seen some spectacularly dumb defensive play by both teams.

This has been an amazing series so far, and I bet tonight isn't even the one moment everyone will remember because I imagine some more crazy stuff will happen.

[NJTank]

Maybe the call would have been different if Middlebrooks legs did not go up, but it was clearly the right call whether it was the first inning or the ninth inning. Jim Joyce is the best umpire in baseball and he made the right call and did not even hesitate, Salty should have never forced that throw to third even with bad wheels it would have been a longshot to get Craig at third in the first place.

[infrared41]

It looked like the right call to me, but I hate to see a World Series game end like that.

[DEAD!]

It looked like the right call to me, but I hate to see a World Series game end like that.

I hate to see it end like that as well, but the umpires have gotten so much grief with blown calls. So for once, they should be praised for enforcing the rules correctly, no?