PittsburghSucks

2020 NFL Season

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1 hour ago, CS85 said:

 

Football sure is dumb sometimes.

 

Truly our worst sport and this is why I don't engage with this team on an emotional level any more. We're not the Steelers, Patriots, Broncos, or Packers. Good stuff doesn't happen to us. There's never a reward, just increasingly elaborate ways the rug gets pulled out from under us. It's never been fun, it's never been worth it. 

 

The worst part is this was not only possible, but anyone who's watched this team at all this season or the last couple of seasons felt like this exact worst case scenario was very likely. They had one of the worst Olines in football last year and their response to drafting the best college quarterback since Andrew Luck, the guy who prematurely retired because his own dingdong franchise didn't protect him, was "ahh the oline wasn't that bad". It's annoying to say I told you so to your own team, but play with fire and we all get burnt, which is why, again, I don't invest a lot of time thinking about them any more. If it was a fluke thing I could deal with it, but this wasn't a fluke. This was inevitable. This was the result of football malpractice at the teambuilding level while calling an irresponsible number of passing plays behind that dangerously bad o-line. My own reaction when they cut back to him writhing on the ground and clutching his knee was just, "yep, been waiting for that". The headlines in Cincinnati should read "The Thing We All Knew Was Gonna Happen Happened". I feel truly bad for him and if I was him I'd sign with another franchise when my rookie contract expires. 

 

 

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20 hours ago, BBTV said:

The word "generational" gets thrown around way too much these days.  Can a guy play one full season before being labeled as a once-in-a-generation talent?  Nothing against Joe Burrow, but at this point in his career he's not even in the discussion for top guy, let alone "generational".  

 

Hell - half the NBA is "generational" - which means none of it is.

 

It's like how some dopes throw around "iconic" when they really mean "it's a logo that I like."

While “generational” does get thrown around too much, from the limited amount we saw of burrow I’d say he easily had the potential to be. 

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4 hours ago, dont care said:

While “generational” does get thrown around too much, from the limited amount we saw of burrow I’d say he easily had the potential to be. 

 

So then what's Mahomes?  Tua?  The Arizona guy?  Are they all "generational"?  If they are, then none are because it's obvious that more than one comes along in a generation.  While it was an absurd amount of luck that Peyton and Brady were active at the same time, and were absolutely "generational", if there's handfuls of these guys coming out every year, then they're not "generational", they're "once every 5 years" or something like that.

 

"Generational" > HOFer.  It's a word that should be used very sparingly.

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Generational is a word that came from the NBA, and I agree that it's become hyperbolic.

 

I think "foundational" is probably better at this point. And far more accurate.

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13 minutes ago, DG_ThenNowForever said:

Generational is a word that came from the NBA, and I agree that it's become hyperbolic.

 

I think "foundational" is probably better at this point. And far more accurate.

 

"Foundational" = "franchise player"?

 

I'm proclaiming myself to be a "generational" poster.

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2 minutes ago, BBTV said:

 

"Foundational" = "franchise player"?

 


Pretty much - a guy you build your team around.

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The Bucs are going to go about as far as their defense can take them. The way they’re playing this year, that’s probably a wild card spot and and a first round playoff exit. 
 

I’m happy because this is a WAY better spot for them to be than I anticipated at the end of last season. But, yeah. That defense, the secondary in particular, needs some serious work. 
 

EDIT: Nevermind. Tom Brady is pretty much fully washed. What an absolute dog :censored: game from him tonight. The Bucs might as well still have Mike Glennon if that’s what they’re going to get out of Brady. 
 

EDIT #2: Overall point is, I’m not impressed with this years version of the Buccaneers. 

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5 hours ago, DG_ThenNowForever said:

Generational is a word that came from the NBA, and I agree that it's become hyperbolic.

 

I think "foundational" is probably better at this point. And far more accurate.


I’m a solid role player. What does that make me, a “building block?”

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On 11/17/2020 at 3:57 PM, Sec19Row53 said:

Super Bowl titles with QB Jesus while being in compliance with the salary cap: 0

No, I'm not still bitter. Why do you ask? 😂😂

 

Denver didn't cheat the salary cap. It was an accounting issue, and it had to do with too many deferred payments:

 

https://www.milehighreport.com/2015/5/9/8577091/the-truth-behind-the-denver-broncos-salary-cap-scandal

 

You must be confusing the Broncos with the 49ers, the real salary cap cheaters of the 90's. Nobody talks about that, though.

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6 hours ago, Red Wolf said:


I’m a solid role player. What does that make me, a “building block?”

 

Maybe a window or door?  Doorknob?  Something that serves a distinct purpose but technically the house will remain standing without them.

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13 hours ago, BBTV said:

 

So then what's Mahomes?  Tua?  The Arizona guy?  Are they all "generational"?  If they are, then none are because it's obvious that more than one comes along in a generation.  While it was an absurd amount of luck that Peyton and Brady were active at the same time, and were absolutely "generational", if there's handfuls of these guys coming out every year, then they're not "generational", they're "once every 5 years" or something like that.

 

"Generational" > HOFer.  It's a word that should be used very sparingly.

VERY sparingly. Generational talent definitely is only one guy per generation. When I think of generational talent, I think of Lebron, Jordan, or maybe even Griffey, Jr. 25 years ago. 

 

I look at the NFL and I don't really see a clear cut generational talent. There are certainly a few that are contenders but it's hard to say that any of them are definite.

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This conversation really only applies to QBs anyway, but I've taken to borrowing the term "unicorn" from silicon valley to apply to great QBs/QBs who might actually be worth giving a contract extension to (NOTE: more NFL QBs get lucrative extensions than merit them, usually harming the team in the process) *whistles, notes Rams defense again carrying Jared Goff's worthless ass over the finish line*.

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Generational means once in a generation guys. I suppose you could argue that several guys at once are "generational" in that they together make up a specific generation's class of elite players. Like when you speak about a generation who are the guys you'd mention? In that sense it's fine that Manning and Brady are both said to be generational even though they played at the same time. I also don't think it's something you can use in the present tense. Patrick Mahomes, if he stays healthy, will be generational. He's yet to play a bad game in the NFL, but if something goes wrong and he, oh I don't know just throwing out a hypothetical scenario here, shreds his entire knee, and then is never the same then the discussion will change. 

 

Joe Burrow is very good, which was made even more clear when Ryan Finley came in and couldn't complete a pass. You can build a championship winning team around a guy like that (well, a normal franchise could). That's foundational. Remains to be seen if he's generational. It'll be an even harder uphill climb now. 

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8 hours ago, DnBronc said:

 

Denver didn't cheat the salary cap. It was an accounting issue, and it had to do with too many deferred payments:

 

https://www.milehighreport.com/2015/5/9/8577091/the-truth-behind-the-denver-broncos-salary-cap-scandal

 

You must be confusing the Broncos with the 49ers, the real salary cap cheaters of the 90's. Nobody talks about that, though.

Cheating the salary cap is done by deferring too many/much payments. If you aren't in compliance with the salary cap, you're cheating.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/02/14/revisiting-denvers-cap-penalties-from-the-1990s/

 

All in good fun, I hope you understand. I toss that one around. The reasons the Packers lost that game:

 

1 - Denver took offense to being an afterthought in that game, and came out the much better team.

[big gap here]

2 - Holmgren was already on his way out the door to buy the groceries and make the meal

3 - Gabe Wilkins made the financial decision to not play so that he could cash in as a free agent.

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1 hour ago, Sport said:

Generational means once in a generation guys. I suppose you could argue that several guys at once are "generational" in that they together make up a specific generation's class of elite players. Like when you speak about a generation who are the guys you'd mention? In that sense it's fine that Manning and Brady are both said to be generational even though they played at the same time. I also don't think it's something you can use in the present tense. Patrick Mahomes, if he stays healthy, will be generational. He's yet to play a bad game in the NFL, but if something goes wrong and he, oh I don't know just throwing out a hypothetical scenario here, shreds his entire knee, and then is never the same then the discussion will change. 

 

Joe Burrow is very good, which was made even more clear when Ryan Finley came in and couldn't complete a pass. You can build a championship winning team around a guy like that (well, a normal franchise could). That's foundational. Remains to be seen if he's generational. It'll be an even harder uphill climb now. 

 

I heard "generational" used for Carson Wentz based on his play in 2017 up until his injury.  Welp.

 

You can have more than one "generational" player active at a time, but it's extremely rare.  I'd say NBA did with Kobe, LeBron, and I'll even go as far as to say Shaq - but even that's borderline.  Mike Trout is probably generational - but I'm not sure that anyone else in MLB is in that discussion.  There's a few active guys that will no doubt be in the HOF, but that's always the case. HOF players are, by definition, rare - but they're always there.  There's guys we heard our fathers talk about that were so unbelievable that we couldn't even imagine someone being that good (Babe Ruth for example), because we never saw it in our generation.  Until we did.  And then those guys are the ones we'll be talking about that the next generation won't understand until one comes along in their lifetime.  

 

I think there's a little recent bias now because we see highlights of everyone ever night and always remember the great plays and who made them, but there's really only one guy active in the NBA right now that truly transcends the game and is a bona fide living legend, and that's Joel "The Process" Embiid.  Lebron is in the discussion as well, but let's give it a little more time to see how his career plays out.

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Yeah, "generational" has gotten out of hand and that's not a surprise, because so much of the NBA is out of hand and silly.

 

There's so much pressure in the NFL to land a good starting QB that teams have to 1. fall in love with a guy, 2. be brutal about that love pretty much immediately and 3. be ready to break up and move on. See: Josh Rosen for this experience brutally carried out by two teams in consecutive seasons.

 

There was a time you could draft Steve McNair and let him sit for however many seasons, but that's never happening again. Teams need to see if Tua can play (and then pull him in the fourth? WTF?) and, if not, get that bum the hell out of Miami.

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1 hour ago, DG_ThenNowForever said:

Yeah, "generational" has gotten out of hand and that's not a surprise, because so much of the NBA is out of hand and silly.

 

There's so much pressure in the NFL to land a good starting QB that teams have to 1. fall in love with a guy, 2. be brutal about that love pretty much immediately and 3. be ready to break up and move on. See: Josh Rosen for this experience brutally carried out by two teams in consecutive seasons.

 

There was a time you could draft Steve McNair and let him sit for however many seasons, but that's never happening again. Teams need to see if Tua can play (and then pull him in the fourth? WTF?) and, if not, get that bum the hell out of Miami.

 

I'll never understand the "he needs to sit, watch, and learn" for a season or two before playing.  When he drafted McNabb, Andy Reid said that he might not play for two seasons (he ended up taking over for starting QB and now coach Doug Pederson before the end of season 1.)

 

When they drafted Carson Wentz, the GM said that he should sit and watch for at least a year, and spend that time "getting to know the city, getting to know and understand our fans, and (something like) just learn what it means to be an NFL player".  LOLOLOLOLOLOL.  The defensive end you drafted doesn't need to "learn what it means to be an NFL player"?  The first-round left tackle doesn't need to "learn about our city and our fans" for a whole goddam year?

 

It's a perfect example of how NFL GMs and coaches think that they're scientists and not oafs that simply teach people how to hit other people in the head.  If a player ends up being great, it's not because he sat.  It's because... he's great!  

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Didn't Peyton have a garbage rookie season? 

There's definitely an adjustment period between playing in College & the NFL. 

 

Would Mahomes have been as great if he didn't sit for a year? Would he still have an MVP season if he started in 2017? 

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Not to mention the injury risk presented by an extra year behind center (see Joe Burrow). An extra year gives the QB a chance to learn the playbook better, develop relationships with his receivers, and just generally get a feel for being on an NFL team before the pressure of starting, with bonus points if he has a veteran starter to learn from. There are pros and cons to sitting and starting a rookie quarterback, and Burrow demonstrates the biggest con of playing them.

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