When Sports Aesthetic Criticism Goes Bad

[Gothamite]

I think we can all agree on that.

[guest23]

freedom of speech

freedom to be dumbass pricks.

childish antics. but what can we expect from these homophobic southern morons. they get taught creationism in high school---how we can we expect reason or tolerance from such people?

Now hold up a second. There is no since in bashing Southern Beliefs in religion. This topic has nothing to do with God and I will take a stand against anyone knocking how us southerners were raised. Because there are idiots all over the world and there is no sense in calling out Southerners who were raised in religion as the evildoers.

You're a backwards ass redneck.

Freedom of Speech.

Hmmmm, nice try troll. I dont even live in the states and even I know that Freedom Of Speech means you cannot be imprisoned by the Government for speaking out against them, and that's about it.

It does not give you the right to intimidate or verbally abuse someone as you did above, those are still crimes... but then you knew that which is why you did have the balls to sign in under a genuine user name!

9erssteeve

I'm just exercising my right to name call like the redneck is justifying. Why does it matter if my name calling is directed to an individual as opposed to a group. It's all free speech right? This means I have the the right to voice my opinion that this redneck who doesn't see the big deal and implicitly supports this idiocy of these kids. Southerners never see the big deal when they are are simply "speaking their beliefs" (aka spreading hate) but are the 1st ones to cry foul and play the victim card when they perceive are being persecuted.

You're also right I really need to grow some balls and get a real internet tough guy handle like "9erssteeve" cause you're keepin it so real on the iternets.

[OldRamsFan]

I love purple as well. In fact, when I was a youngun, I was looking a pic of Deacon Jones and the lighting made the blue look purple. To this day, I wish the Rams would switch blue for purple.

[ONUV]

[mod redacted]

[DC in Da House w/o a Doubt]

There are currently 22,222 threads in the Sports Logos forum! Thought everyone oughta know!

Pressures on for whoever makes 22,223. It better be worth it.

[The_Admiral]

3rd, why does writing it down make it worse? It's a phrase used increasingly TV shows

"Gay" as a synonym for "lame" is actually on the decline.

[IceCap]

freedom of speech

freedom to be dumbass pricks.

childish antics. but what can we expect from these homophobic southern morons. they get taught creationism in high school---how we can we expect reason or tolerance from such people?

Now hold up a second. There is no since in bashing Southern Beliefs in religion. This topic has nothing to do with God and I will take a stand against anyone knocking how us southerners were raised. Because there are idiots all over the world and there is no sense in calling out Southerners who were raised in religion as the evildoers.

Ummm...American Christianity for the most part DOES tend to promote homophobia, etc. (You know, they whole "homosexuality is a sin" bit). They also tend to push the notion that "homosexuality is a choice" for related reasons which...well...a growing body of scientific evidence indicates that may not be entirely the case.

Christianity teaches people that one "sin" is not bigger than another and that we should love the person and not the sin. As far as homosexuality being a choice, I have never believed that. In fact, once Eve removed the apple from the tree she made us all be born into sin, therefore we could either be born as a homosexual, alcoholic, addicted to drugs, etc.

This is just....wow....it's extremely offensive.

Of course everyone's getting in on that it seems, but this was by far the worst example of it.

The kids with the banner? Offensive idiots who should be disciplined. Bigotry of any kind should not be tolerated.

The rest of this thread just sucks.

[Morgan33]

The kids with the banner? Offensive idiots who should be disciplined. Bigotry of any kind should not be tolerated.

The rest of this thread just sucks.

Calling a uniform "gay..." Stupid? Yes. Bigotry? Give me a break, it's an inanimate object! 9erssteve knocked it out of the park with his initial assessment.

[rams80]

The kids with the banner? Offensive idiots who should be disciplined. Bigotry of any kind should not be tolerated.

The rest of this thread just sucks.

Calling a uniform "gay..." Stupid? Yes. Bigotry? Give me a break, it's an inanimate object! 9erssteve knocked it out of the park with his initial assessment.

Would you feel the same way if "Negro-ish" was used instead?

[Lights Out]

freedom of speech

...NOT freedom from backlash. The homophobic high schoolers are free to be idiots, but the rest of us are equally free to rip them to shreds for it.

[GriffinM6]

Now I know I've said some things about my views of gay on here, and they weren't that nice, but I'm going to be respectful about this. The problem with this whole deal, is that those kids were allowed into that game with that poster. Maybe they rolled it up, so no one would see the inside. Honestly, I think that the school needs to start looking at what students have on their signs before games. This could help stop any future problems for a situation like this.

[nuordr]

Now I know I've said some things about my views of gay on here, and they weren't that nice, but I'm going to be respectful about this. The problem with this whole deal, is that those kids were allowed into that game with that poster. Maybe they rolled it up, so no one would see the inside. Honestly, I think that the school needs to start looking at what students have on their signs before games. This could help stop any future problems for a situation like this.

Similar to what the WWE does when you enter a wrestling event like RAW or SMACKDOWN.

[Kevin W.]

Now I know I've said some things about my views of gay on here, and they weren't that nice, but I'm going to be respectful about this. The problem with this whole deal, is that those kids were allowed into that game with that poster. Maybe they rolled it up, so no one would see the inside. Honestly, I think that the school needs to start looking at what students have on their signs before games. This could help stop any future problems for a situation like this.

Similar to what the WWE does when you enter a wrestling event like RAW or SMACKDOWN.

Not exactly. WWE is free to remove signs like that as a private business but if the school started doing it, they might run into trouble with the First Amendment. As a public school, they are an extension of the federal government and freedom of speech might come into play. However, that's not likely since students do sacrifice portions of their Constitutional rights when participating in school functions. It's just not the same situation as a private business taking away signs at a live event.

[scottysprings]

This thread really does suck. I think the author of the Yahoo article put it pretty well:

There has been no official punishment for the Spanish Fort fans who brought in the sign, or those pictured on national television laughing at it. School officials told Alabama NBC affiliate Local15 that the students who held up the banner and those around them were spoken to after the game, and on Monday were "spoken to by the principal and he, believe me, will carry out a disciplinary action." Yet perhaps there doesn't even need to be additional punishment. After all, anyone who sees the sign now will form their own opinions about the Spanish Fort student population, unfair though that may be. Of no fault of their masses, the Toros suddenly have a new homophobic reputation to defend against, and that might be punishment enough.

[9erssteve]

Whenever anyone says, "I hate all this PC crap", what they're actually saying is, "I miss the good old days when the people we like to make fun of kept their mouths shut."

Sorry no not the case, at least not for me. I'm all for stamping out GENUINE slurs, be they racist, sexist, homophobic, you name it.

Excellent.

You should then be in favor of "stamping out" the use of "gay" as a perjoritive. The kids in this specific instance are using the word to insult other kids by implying that there is something wrong or less masculine or shameful about being homosexual.

When you strip away everything else, all the hypotheticals and everything, that's what we're left with.

Can we agree that what the kids did with their banner was wrong?

I'm not denying it was wrong, never have. My biggest issue with the whole PC thing is people being offended on other peoples behalf. Putting aside the whole who "owns" the term gay argument, you're right here the term should not be used as it was being used to try and provoke a reaction, but how many complaints were actually received by ESPN regarding it? And how many of them were from the gay community? My question is whether real offense was caused, or was it just laughed off as "stupid kids" which is what I reckon the majority of my gay friends would have done

My biggest worry is that by leaping to the supposed defence of gays, or any other section of community, BEFORE they have the chance to actually register real offense is you just reinforce the stereotype that those sections of the community cant look out for themselves. Which is total BS cos these sections of community are just as capable of anything as the so called "mainstream". We dont need to get offended for them, if they were offended let them come forward and together we can fix the issue.

What those kids did wasn't smart or clever and it certainly wasn't funny, and it should not happen again but my question is how offensive did gay people actually find it? And as of right now I dont think any of us know, as THAT hasn't been reported, it's only been ASSUMED on the gay community's behalf, and personally I find that just as demeaning, because it implies we need to baby them. And trust me WE DONT, the few gay friends I have can take care of themselves and will win an insult battle ANY DAY!

9erssteve

[hailstateunis]

Please lock this thread mods. Each side of this argument are just insulting each other and nothing good can come out of it.

[IceCap]

The kids with the banner? Offensive idiots who should be disciplined. Bigotry of any kind should not be tolerated.

The rest of this thread just sucks.

Calling a uniform "gay..." Stupid? Yes. Bigotry? Give me a break, it's an inanimate object! 9erssteve knocked it out of the park with his initial assessment.

You don't see a problem with using the term "gay" as a synonym for "lame" or "stupid"?

All 9erssteve did was try to argue semantics, that the homosexual community doesn't "own" the word gay. Which is a pretty ridiculous statement. Yes, the word started off with an unrelated meaning, but in the year 2012 it's recognized to mean "homosexual" above any other meaning it might have. To argue otherwise is either an exercise in naivety or hair splitting to try and fight the imaginary "PC Police."

The term is recognized as a word to describe homosexuality first and foremost in our society. I know it, you know it, 9erssteve knows it, and those idiots in Alabama know it. Using the term "gay" in the manner that they did was meant to use the term in a derogatory manner. Which qualifies as bigotry, whether you like it or not.

As for the "well were any gay people actually offended?" argument, well let me ask him (and you too Morgo since you seem to be game) this. Say a gay member of our boards says he was offended. Or say a gay person or a gay civil rights group announces that they found the banner offensive, will you drop your ridiculous opposition to condemning bigoted behaviour?

That aside though, we shouldn't have to wait for "confirmation" to know if something's offensive. You can't call me a kike and then claim you didn't know it was wrong until AFTER I tell you I'm offended. There are some words and phrases and connotations that we all know are bigoted. Toleration of bigotry by some shouldn't give those terms and people who use them a free pass.

[Gothamite]

Agreed. We don't need to check with black people to ask if the n-word is still offensive, nor do we need to wait for a complaint from people of Chinese descent to know that "Chinks" is wholly inappropriate.

the imaginary "PC Police."

Can't be repeated enough. Talk about a straw man...

[Morgan33]

You don't see a problem with using the term "gay" as a synonym for "lame" or "stupid"?

All 9erssteve did was try to argue semantics, that the homosexual community doesn't "own" the word gay. Which is a pretty ridiculous statement. Yes, the word started off with an unrelated meaning, but in the year 2012 it's recognized to mean "homosexual" above any other meaning it might have. To argue otherwise is either an exercise in naivety or hair splitting to try and fight the imaginary "PC Police."

The term is recognized as a word to describe homosexuality first and foremost in our society. I know it, you know it, 9erssteve knows it, and those idiots in Alabama know it. Using the term "gay" in the manner that they did was meant to use the term in a derogatory manner. Which qualifies as bigotry, whether you like it or not.

As for the "well were any gay people actually offended?" argument, well let me ask him (and you too Morgo since you seem to be game) this. Say a gay member of our boards says he was offended. Or say a gay person or a gay civil rights group announces that they found the banner offensive, will you drop your ridiculous opposition to condemning bigoted behaviour?

That aside though, we shouldn't have to wait for "confirmation" to know if something's offensive. You can't call me a kike and then claim you didn't know it was wrong until AFTER I tell you I'm offended. There are some words and phrases and connotations that we all know are bigoted. Toleration of bigotry by some shouldn't give those terms and people who use them a free pass.

No I don't see a problem with it, not even remotely. If every person in High School was expelled for using the word "Gay" as a pejorative there would be nobody left. The homosexual community doesn't own the word gay and if people want to use it as a synonym for "Lame," or "Stupid" that is their right. I don't recall anyone getting their panties in a twist when the homosexual community adapted it and bastardized it's original meaning, In a free society, either all words are acceptable or none are and I'm getting sick and tired of this P.C. bull dictating the way they are used. Upon reading this thread it's clear the "PC Police" is far from imaginary.

[Chawls]

Morgo, your opinion is so nigga.

[/sarcasm]

See what I did there? While you're right in saying that no community owns a word, its bastardization and subsequent misuse doesn't make it any more acceptable a synonym for "lame" or "stupid". I despise political correctness too, but as responsible adults, it's important for us to understand and respect the fact that the careless use of certain words still have a very profound effect on certain groups of people and those effects should not be taken lightly, rather they affect you personally or not.